BATMAN AND ROBIN #15

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Written by GRANT MORRISON
Art by FRAZER IRVING
Cover by FRANK QUITELY
Variant cover by FRAZER IRVING

Size: 32 pages
Price: 2.99

This review contains spoilers, click here to read

Story: 5 - Excellent
Art: 5 - Excellent

Comments

  1. Great review. Glad you put in the reading necessary to enjoy the current issues after being turned off initially.

    I agree in general about what you said regarding how it’s not that people who don’t like GM’s Batman are "stupid" or whatever or that those who like it must be "smart". I would say it’s not a matter of intelligence (of which there are different types anyway), but it’s a matter of the work that the reader puts in. It isn’t that GM’s Batman rewards you for being "smart", but it rewards you for…reading…reading closely and actively. That seems a fair deal to me, but I can understand why that experience isn’t for some people, who want more straightforward entertainment, and of course that’s their choice and it’s fine.

    But the situation does get kinda frustrating to see some people understand and enjoy certain, obvious crowd-pleasing elements about GM’s Batman ("Crowbar!)"), but then they’re blind to all the under-lying goodness that you only see after a critical reading or two. You don’t blame the other reader; but you just wish more people would "get" it so they can see all the neat stuff you’re seeing. That’s how I feel.

    But…So many neat touches and callbacks in this issue. Pyg is "Thomas Wayne’s" lawyer in this issue, and last issue Hurt told Pyg he’d make a good lawyer. And Hurt last issue was practicing shooting vegetables to make the smallest hole, and in this issue he shoots Dick in such a way that he doesn’t get instantly killed.

    btw, Don’t know if you have them, but be sure to reading "Batman & Son", "The Black Glove", Batman 670 & 671, and 52 #30 & #47. Those are the things pre-RIP that are relevant to the run. (And kinda "Batman: Gothic".)

  2. I was so hoping that this would be the end of the story, especially since BW The Road Home already started last week!!  I was absolutely loving it for a while, but aren’t they kinda dragging this out a bit?

  3. Pretty envious but glad actually you guys have been able tie it all together to see all the ‘underlying goodness’ that others who might not be following the details so closely seem to be blind to.  I’ve tried to enjoy Morrison’s stuff, as I don’t consider myself as just wanting straightforward entertainment, and I do consider myself an active reader, but his writing has rarely failed to confuse the shit outta me, and the frustration that results leads to a less enjoyable reading experience….until this book, which by itself was able to hold its own as a stand-alone issue, with what I thought was minimal enough cryptic dialogue from Morrison that is usually the stuff that turns me off about his writing, but I guess is the kinda stuff that peeps who get it and have been following closer than I have like.

    Btw:  the blood-curdling scream Damian lets out when Joker takes his muzzle off in the beginning really sets the tone, that was awesome.

  4. I only started reading this with Batman & Robin #1. Needless to say I don’t really have a clue about what is going on. What was in the box? It was pretty unclear to me?

  5. Y’know, I only really ever take issue with the fact that people seem to lump Morrison detractors into one category – as people who don’t like to/want to "work for the story."

    There’s a bit of a passive-aggressiveness here, as no one actually states this outright, but the idea is that "if you read it closely, you’ll see that it’s great." It suggests that anyone who doesn’t think it’s great hasn’t been reading closely. 

    My issues with Morrison have NOTHING to do with a critical reading to the material or a lack of understanding. I’ve watched Morrison change his storytelling style, change the way he cuts scenes, and change the pacing of his stories. And I have found some of the changes to be lacking. This has nothing to do with a lack of understanding of the larger picture, the symbolism, or the overarching themes. I’ve simply found points at which his storytelling is offputting to me as a reader. 

    That said: this Batman and Robin series actually seemed to shift away from a bit of what bothered me previously, and I’ve been enjoying this series quite a bit. In fact, I’ve also been enjoying his Bruce Wayne time travel story.

  6. daccampo swoops in with an excellent retort as always.  I am not a Morrison detractor by any stretch.  Love RIP, JLA, and other stories, but this series has just completely lost me.  And its not a matter of not putting in the work.  I re-read a majority of the series when the last issue came out. 

    My issue with this series has to do with the fact that his storytelling relies too much on me catching the nuances and not enough time actually telling the story.  I feel like he’s being too clever to the detriment of the story.  I don’t mind having little nods here and there to previous things (like the ones mentioned in your review), but when I have to read every issue with a microscope and a notebook with detailed notes of the previous issues, it takes away from my overall enjoyment.   And I’m glad that people enjoy it and that he’s a creator that pushes the envelope.  But as much as I appreciate that, he still frustrates me sometimes with the way he constructs his stories.   

  7. I’ve read nine issues of this run. Thought that four of the nine issues were excellent but they were not mind blowing on some literary criticism type shit.

    So not only do I agree with daccampo, I’ll one up him and say that as far as I can tell (I haven’t read R.I.P. or Final Crisis) the multifaceted mindblowing substance that cats are claiming his Batman books have, isn’t there.

    It might be rich continuity, which can be very rewarding, but I haven’t read anything in this run that has changed how I view super hero dynamics, comics, storytelling or literary conventions.

    There is definitely excellent characterization, character moments, dialogue, plot lines and action scenes. But I think even Morrison detractors should be able to see that.

    Nevertheless, djd’s review was awesome and his explanation about the rewards of and impenetriability of continuity was perfectly executed.

  8. Great review. I liked how you settled the differences between Morrison-lovers and haters. You would be a great diplomat!

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