You know the easiest way to prove you're not the smartest person in the room? By proclaiming yourself to be the smartest person in the room. If you're great at what you do, it shines through in your actions. People will notice. And in business, your bosses, co-workers and customers surely will.
What does that have to do with comics? Well sadly I feel this industry may be going down a path that is the functional equivalent of walking into a room and telling everyone how great you are. In a world of Facebook and Twitter and YouTube and video games and, yes, comics, it's increasingly difficult to obtain and retain people's attention. There are a million other things that can capture our attention at a given moment. As a result, societal behavior is evolving. And with it, so too are marketing and public relations. That's perfectly reasonable, but with change can come some poor decisions.
I think Marvel made one of those poor choices this week, with the announcement of the Marvel Architects.
The very fabric of the Marvel Universe is changing and the Architects are the ones leading the charge! Marvel’s Architects initiative spotlights the writers and artists telling the most exciting and impactful stories that rock the Marvel Universe to its very core every month.
But just who are the writers in Marvel’s Architects?
·Brian Michael Bendis, writer of AVENGERS, NEW AVENGERS, Death of Spider-Man, the upcoming MOON KNIGHT and an upcoming top secret project
· Matt Fraction, writer of THOR, INVINCIBLE IRON MAN, and a top secret upcoming event
· Ed Brubaker, writer of CAPTAIN AMERICA, SECRET AVENGERS and top secret upcoming new series
· Jonathan Hickman, writer of FANTASTIC FOUR, S.H.I.E.L.D. and a top secret upcoming new series
· Jason Aaron, writer of WOLVERINE, ASTONISHING SPIDER-MAN & WOLVERINE and a top secret upcoming new series
“These are five of the top writers in comics and they’re writing some of the best Marvel comics ever” said C.B. Cebulski, SVP Creator & Content Development. “Each of their projects lays the groundwork for the future of the Marvel Universe and in 2011, their plans—which are being seeded in their current work as we speak—will come to fruition. There’s never been a better time to be a Marvel fan.”
Stay tuned to Marvel.com for more news on Marvel’s Architects, including interviews and the unveiling of the artists redefining the Marvel Universe!
OK, before I dive into why I think this is marketing gone awry, let's get a few things out of the way.
- I adore Marvel comics…while I read comics from all sorts of publishers each month, Marvel has been my mainstay for almost 30 years
- Each of these writers, to a man, deserves recognition for their excellence. As far as I know I've read nearly everything this quintet has ever published, from The Nightly News to Powers to Sleeper to The Other Side to Five Fists of Science
- My forthcoming condemnation of this marketing ploy is directed at those who created it, not the writers who are featured in it (I doubt they had any role in the creation of this gimmick)
Now that we're clear on the ground rules, let's get to why I find this announcement so offputting.It sends the wrong message to the majority of Marvel's own creators
While the "Architects" probably feel good being singled out for their importance, what does that say about the other creators on the payroll? Marvel puts out 80+ titles a month, and employs dozens of writers on a monthly basis. By labeling this quintet the "writers telling the most exciting and impactful stories that rock the Marvel Universe to its very core every month," are they not telling everyone else on the writing staff…"Hey guys, your stuff is secondary." Why wasn't Rick Remender included in this announcement? Last time I checked he's the writer of Marvel's top-selling book the last two months. What about Dan Slott? Isn't he helming one of Marvel's top franchises (Spider-Man)? How about Greg Pak? Did he not reshape the Hulk into relevance again? Dan Abnett & Andy Lanning? Have they not single-handedly recast the Marvel Cosmic into a rich pocket of the Marvel Universe while telling not one, not two, but three great events in succession? Is what Jeff Parker is doing inconsequential to the "fabric of the Marvel universe?" Has Fred Van Lente not told some of the smartest, most entertaining and innovative stories at the House of Ideas?I've seen others compare this announcement to Marvel's Young Guns initiative a few years ago. I don't think it's comparable. The Young Guns was meant to promote young, up-and-coming artists who were coming into their own. It set to draw attention to creators who were perceived by many as ascending into spots of importance. The Young Guns was about raising said artists up to an EQUIVALENT level with many of the other well known and established artists on the payroll. That was an inclusive marketing campaign. This? It's exclusionary by its very nature. It stands to set these five guys above everyone else.
Don't think for a second people in the industry don't already know the score. Do you think other writers needed an official announcement from on high that Bendis was a big dog? Or that Brubaker (who has won a boatload of Eisners in recent years) is a key cog in the wheel? People in the industry understand who is who. And if they're being honest with themselves, they know where they sit in the pantheon. But that doesn't mean they like being formally reminded of it by their employer.
It sends the wrong message to retailers
Retailers already give an inordinate amount of their shelf space to the Big 2, and as we see with books like Thor: The Mighty Avenger and Doctor Voodoo and Atlas and Captain Britain & MI-13, it's hard to keep mid-list titles (even beautifully written and drawn books) afloat in today's market. What better way to further accelerate the death of the mid list than telling retailers that there are just five guys that are ready to "rock the Marvel Universe to its very core every month." Also, is it any coincidence that at a time when Marvel is getting pressure for maintaining the line on $3.99 comics that we're told how IMPORTANT the writers of the majority of those $3.99 books are?It sends the wrong message to the customers
Along the same vein as the message Marvel is sending to retailers, customers are being misguided. When we complain about the cancellation of books like the aforementioned Thor: The Mighty Avenger or Atlas we're told politely by the powers-that-be that we should have supported them more. I.e., not enough of us bought them. Yet, Marvel is telling us that they don't matter! Because after all, the "Architects are leading the charge!" So why do I need to buy an all ages title outside of the 616, after all, it wasn't written by an Architect. Why bother checking out the Black Panther: Man Without Fear or Heroes for Hire or She-Hulks? I mean they're not important…they weren't written by Architects and, therefore, aren't "the most exciting and impactful stories."At the end of the day, this is probably just another press release in a never-ending stream of them. And a few days from now there will be another news cycle for people to react to. But I honestly thought this particular announcement deserved close scrutiny, as I fail to see how it fosters any positive feedback (outside of the five guys named, and they didn't need a presser to reinforce their own abilities or place at the table), yet I see many ways it sends the wrong messages. Judging from the press release, we have another salvo of architects coming in the form of the artists involved. Marvel marketing executives, do yourselves and the cadre of massively talented creators in your employ a favor and pull the plug on Round Two of the Architects.
Jason Wood is a mutant with the ability to squeeze 36 hours into every 24-hour day, which is why he was able to convince his wife he had time to join the iFanboy team on top of running his business, raising his three sons, and most importantly, co-hosting the 11 O'Clock Comics podcast with his buddies Vince B, Chris Neseman and David Price. If you are one of the twelve people on Earth who want to read about comics, the stock market and football in rapid fire succession, you can follow him on Twitter.
Find us on Facebook
Follow us on Twitter
Subscribe to our RSS Feed
Some rights reserved.
Great article Jason. Describing is as an exclusionary campaign is completely correct in my eyes as is the detrimental effect it may have on the lesser known titles.
++++
Agreed. It’s far too easy for guys like, say, Peter David to up and leave if they feel like they’re underappreciated and only get the leftovers. They don’t need to be driving away talent.
I don’t know if it should be taken that seriously, @Wood. After all, what does a marketing platform have to do with how comics are consumed at the end of the day in our direct-marketed world? Bendis and Bru will always outsell Ven Lente, whether you tell people BMB is important or not.
Damn. I did not know about this announcement until this article, but you pretty much covered my reaction. I could actually picture some of those writers cringing at this.
That’s my boo! I’ll just echo Chris and his ++++.
I completely agree with this 100%. Why no Slott? Why no Abnett and Lanning? Why no Pak or Parker? The only reason I can see is each of them have a “secret project” (cue thunder and lightning). So this makes the work the others are doing not as important?
And honestly, of these writers listed as “architects” I read exactly zero of their titles. I have read their books in the past, but currently? Nope, none. I read Marvel books by Slott, Parker, David, and Carey just to name a few.
@WilliamKScurryJr You’re probably right in your final assessment – at least for now. But it’s irresponsible marketing to help in creating that sales disparity.
Also, this announcement, albeit (probably) unintentionally, is a smack in the face to the company’s Women of Marvel campaign. The message here is, yeah, we want to see more female creators – but these guys are the real backbone of the company.
Its really hard to get people to do their best work and stay loyal when you tell them (directly or indirectly) they aren’t valuable and that their work is disposable.
*internet high five*
This is just baiting people to drop the books that are “not important”. We’ve seen on this site far too often that some people tend to give the most love to these books because of their importance or their legacy, and thus rank them higher than the actual quality books. Look no further than the recent Uncanny X Men thread.
I am extremely jealous of you for getting here first.
You’re absolutely right. It aggravates me to my very bones as it is when they write, “You should have supported these little books more if you didn’t want them to get canceled.” Then they begin their latest promotional push… for the biggest name creators they have who already sell all the books. At last, AT LAST Matt Fraction is getting some attention.
This announcement is more lame than anything else. They didn’t actually announce anything and instead made a weak attempt to pat themselves on their own back.
I would feel a lot more strongly about this if I tended to lend any weight to the missives the Marvel releases in general. I absolutely stopped going to Marvels web site after the Cap #25 debacle. That said, I agree that proclaiming “these guys have impact on our Universe”, is kind of like saying “ONLY these guys have impact on our Universe”.
Secondly, I originally was going to say this when it originally happened, but I thought better of it and decided not to make a scene at the wake for the “Mighty Avenger” title that we had here.
I can only surmise by the evidence before me that the readers of iFanboy (myself included) are in no way representative of the comic consumer in general. We can’t be. Look at the titles that were cancelled that were listed in the article. An overwhelming percentage of us loved them. GONE! How? Over and over it seems. And these are not indie titles with no marketing giant behind them. They got premier space in Previews, print and Website ads, etc. And it’s like they don’t stand a chance. the only reason I can come up with it that we have NO IDEA who the bulk of the comic buyers consist of. At first you would think that maybe the industry hasn’t caught up yet, or figured it out, but the bizarre announcements, and the hideous story ideas keep coming. Who the fuck is buying the “shit” in such numbers that quality books (at least to us), pale so much in comparison as to be axed?
@Jimski …I REALLY appreciate those words coming from you, because you bring the realness to your column all the time.
I sincerely hope that this column doesn’t get misconstrued by anyone (particularly the fine folks at Marvel) as my being a “hater” or some such nonsense. I’m just calling fair is fair. As a lifelong Marvel Zombie, I would’ve just as easily penned this column about DC if they pulled a similar move. Hopefully for those that take the time to read what I wrote, they won’t try to put words in my mouth or gloss over the part where I say this is a criticism of the marketing gimmick, and not in any way an indictment of the five men named as I happen to genuinely like their work, to a man.
Wow…I actively avoid the majority of these writers’ books. I think the only things I am still reading by any of them are Ultimate Spider-Man and Invincible Iron Man. When I think of the writers who really make the Marvel U a place I want to spend my time and money, my list runs more like, Gage, David, Pak, Van Lente, Slott…
And yeah, that kind of official celebration of a few as being in some way superior to the rest of the team always does oog me out. Particularly if, as in this case, it seems a mysterious and pointless act. As you said, yep, we all already knew Bendis was top dog. Thanks for the news flash.
Jason Wood, telling us like it is!
I don’t understand the outrage in this. Sorry. To make a sports comparison should all of the other players get upset at the guy who gets a bobblehead day? Should we as fans? I’m not convinced it’s fact that these writers are the shapers of the Marvel U. They write the most influential books. While Remender might write the most popular book, I would hardly say anything of great importance is going to happen in Uncanny X-Force. Maybe Apocolypse will return. The same goes for Hickmans Secret Warriors, it’s not even listed as a book he is writing. As for the actual purpose of this press release I can only hazard that this was meant for non-comic readers. Certainly not the iFanboy audience. It would seem to me that more and more people are going to the Marvel website for non-comics (read movies and TV) related news. Or you could propose that this is just promoting the next Marvel status quo. Marvel could be doing us a solid and getting us prepared for some big changes and these are the writers that will be writing those changes. Sorry, I just don’t see it.
Love a lot of these writers but have to agree thier books sell. Would love the same push to be put behind Parker, Remender and Van Lente.
Oh Marvel, what crazy stunt will you do next?
@ato220 –to use the Sports analogy, winning teams don’t publicly throw role players under the bus to build the ego of a Star. Winning teams constantly promote the idea of team, systems, unselfishness and they give credit to their role players when they earn it. its the loser, last place teams that solely cater to their ego driven diva stars.
All five of these writers are working on a “an upcoming top secret project” – I think it’s pretty clear that this is a teaser announcement for what will most likely be this summer’s Big Event (or maybe an elseworlds/Ultimate universe kind of project, hence “Architects”).
This is pretty run-of-the-mill messaging for Marvel in terms of marketing. It’s not ideal, and I’ve personally never been a fan of the way the roll out campaigns like this because, as Jason has eloquently pointed out, they don’t always send the right messages at first. But I’m sure this is a very small piece of a larger campaign.
I’m with Ato220. I honestly had already forgotten the “Architect” PR until reading this column. I had no idea from thge headline what it was about.
Like Wonder Ali says, all of the writers mentioned have big 2011 announcements coming, and are tied to books that have movies coming out next year, or 2012. Pak, FVL Abnett and Lanning’s stuff all happened in the past eith just wrapping up, or from last year. This is all about a tease for next year’s announcements.
If I may Jason, this kind of reactionary article sends the wrong message to comic fans in the know.
Marvel’s announcement makes me want to throw up.
@wordballoon “Comic fans in the know?” You mean like the dozens of people who responded to this very article and agreed with me that it was a misguided attempt? Or is “in the know” limited to a higher stratosphere of fandom than the members of this great community? Do tell.
Marvel’s marketing over the past year has seemed like gasps of desperation. “Buy the books you’re most likely already buying! Small books don’t mean crap at the end of the day!” Very odd. As Ali and others have said it’s more indicative of a problem than a source. But it just comes off looking silly. And don’t even get me started on that meaningless quote from Cebulski.
i don’t have a problem with Marvel marketing this at all. they’re promoting guys that have a high ratio of hits vs misses; they put people in seats; their name alone sells comics. as Ato220 pointed out: marketing campaign not solely for comic readers. i imagine it’s for ANY reader. think about a reader walking into any bookstore and wants to try a book by one of these authors. the probability of them getting a satisfying read is pretty high means they’ll want more.
@wood – or the other people who disagreed with you.
comic fans in the know Jason are people who can read between the lines of H Y P E and only worry about what really matters.
Sorry, but I tire of the outrage that comes with every PR notice that screams BOOK A WAS A SMASH, or after BOOK B NOTHING WIL BE THE SAME. Same goes for the silliness of YOUNG GUNS And Now ARCHITECTS.
I think many fans have spent enough time reading Stan’s soapbox or listening to Joe Q while he’s sipping from his cup to not give a shit when the HYPE machine is in overdrive.
But by all means, shake your fist .
PS I await THE DEATH OF SPIDER-MAN? with great fear and mistrust
I agree with John @wordballoon.
@wordballoon So your suggestion is… “They’re just hyping anything/everything, no one should bother to point out the “shoot-yourselves-in-the-foot” aspect of it anymore?”
i don’t see how this is Marvel shooting themselves in the foot; they’re marketing guys that sell comics; their names sell comics.
@iSpiderMan It’s shooting themselves in the foot because by putting these guys in this new tier, it seems like they’re giving guys like Remender and Parker the shaft.
@iSpiderM Trust me, this ad is meant for current comic reader. No one walking into a bookstore gives a shit who Bendis or Fraction are, and what their status in the company is. So shooting themseves in the hoof is saying to current comic readers “These are the only ones who count, not the other guys working just as hard.”
@comicBOOKchris – yes, giving Jeff Parker Hulk to write is definitely giving him the shaft. Remender on Punisher and now top-selling Uncanny X-Force is treating him terribly. Man, if only Marvel would give these guys titles to just get noticed.
To paraphrase Bruce Willis from Pulp Fiction
I didn’t know about this until you told me about it and now that I know you wanna know how i feel about it? I don’t feel the least bit bad about it.
As someone who has written PR for a University, 9 times out of 10 the people who work for the company never pay attention to these kinds of things unless a big deal is made about them.
Remender on Punisher: The Once-Ongoing-Series-That-Was-Cancelled-And-Truncated-Into-A-Mini-Series? Or Parker on Hulk: Might-As-Well-Throw-Parker-A-Bone-Since-WWe’re-Ceasing-To-Support-Atlas? Or Remender on Doctor Voodoo: AVENGER-Of-The-Supernatural?
Ok, here’s my “Zapruder Film” like disection of the press release.
“These are five of the top writers in comics and they’re writing some of the best Marvel comics ever” said C.B. Cebulski, SVP Creator & Content Development.
Does that mean they’re aren’t more top writers in comics, or at Marvel alone? No, but they are writing the top characters and high selling books. Whether they’re “some of the best Marvel Comics ever… I’ll let history decide that, but again, it’s a press release.
here’s the key CB sentance IMO
“Each of their projects lays the groundwork for the future of the Marvel Universe and in 2011, their plans—which are being seeded in their current work as we speak—will come to fruition…”
So, these specific creators have big marvel projects coming next year (WHICH STARTS IN LESS THAN A MONTH) and they are playing out some of these future big event plot points in their specific current books.
Not in Jeff Parker’s books, or FVL, Slott, A&L , Remender, or whomever else you think is being slighted.
Resume fist shaking..
Agreed with Prax. “More indicative of a problem than a source.”
Still, it’s such an obnoxious announcement because it offers no details as to what these events even are. Pitch me stories, not past successes. Too much behind the curtain politics in the Architects concept and not nearly enough…you know…actual project details.
Why not just announce: “More of the same! Playing it safe some more!”
Jeff Parker has stated in interviews that Marvel supported Atlas buy launching it with a new #1, having the team guest-star in other books. He also stated that sales were not good; he decided to end it instead of Marvel having to tell him to end it. Interview can be found on comicbookresources.com. Or you can continue to have your facts (opinion, really).
forgot: resume fist shaking…
I think the message it sends it’s ‘here’s another 5 books that you’ll shell out $3.99 for’. They make the announcement a month about how ‘new books’ will start at a price of $2.99 and then proced to jack the price of every book in their current line up to $3.99. what? Five extra pages in Invincible Iron Man at 3.99? Ok. What? Oh your doing the next issue with 22 pages of story buy leaving the price at $3.99? Yea that makes sense (sarcasm).
Gotta disagree Paul. The notice says big things are coming from these guys, and plot points are already happening in their current books.
It’s a tease. I really think the outrage stems from the lable “architects” given exclusively to these guys, but again the press release is only about these specific writers.
Just like how Secret Warriors was “supposed” to be a limited series.
Again, the most obnoxious thing about this release is that it gives fuel to the people who give more praise to the “important” books instead of the quality books. Remember the shitstorm that started when Scalped was picked over Blackest Night as POTW, or when the X-Force issue when Nightcrawler died wasn’t picked? Everyone’s rational why that should have been picked was that both books were “more important”. It’s truly one of the most obnoxious aspects of comic fandom.
@comicBOOKchris
Secret Warriors IS a limited series. Hickman said in my interviews with him and others that it was planned as a 30 issue limited series.
I’m not outraged exactly. But…the press release is saying….”continue to read the books that are in no danger of cancellation, because things will be happening in them. Not saying what, but they’ll be things.”
If there’s any outrage it’s that someone was paid to write up that copy and another person was paid to design that graphic when they could’ve been saying something of substance about the books that might not be doing so well. i.e. Saying anything at all.
Wonderful piece. I agree with all that you’ve said, and I also want to add another bullet point — it sends the wrong message to creators looking to break in. By highlighting these writers, Marvel is kind of driving home that in order to shape the Marvel Universe, you need to be a straight white dude. It also completely eliminates the contributions of artists, who apparently don’t shape anything, in Marvel’s estimation. I tend to look at writing more than art myself, but ignoring half of the production of a comic is shortsighted at best.
Great article.
I agree that social networking and new media is definitely affecting how comics and their creators are marketed. Aside from the creator himself walking into the room and announcing “I am the smartest”, I think it’s also a problem when avalanches of rabid fans state the same thing. Basically, what I’m saying is that people’s recommendations have become less and less useful to me, especially on this newfangled “cyber space” and especially over the last few years. That’s not to say that the internet (iFanboy especially) doesn’t tell me about great comics that I end up loving, because sometimes it still does and I’m very appreciative. But when people launch their recommendations as brief tweets or as brief context-less recommendations, they just seem like advertising. It’s an attention-span thing, both on my part and on the part of the recommendation-prone fan. But just telling me “Buy ___ comic! It’s great! It’s so good! Read it!” doesn’t nothing for me. When people/creators/companies just do barrage blip-recommendations like that, it really makes me just want to unplug from the internet altogether. But SOMETIMES there’s still great substantive articles out there!
Still, when you wrote: “it’s increasingly difficult to obtain and retain people’s attention. There are a million other things that can capture our attention at a given moment. As a result, societal behavior is evolving”, I think you left the “d” off of “devolving”. 😉
internet++
The ghost of Jack Kirby just told Marvel’s PR Department to go F themselves.
If they had used any other word besides Architect this would be just another meaningless press release.
@ChrisNeseman as someone who’s struggled with having to re-write the same copy over and over again, I see nothing wong with it.
Who can honestly name all the YOUNG GUNS from 5 years ago? I know Jim Cheung was one, but so was Arthur Suydam, who had drawn cover art that was older than some of his YG peers.
it just doesn’t matter
I think what we can all agree on is that this is a poor decision on Marvel’s behalf. The message is unclear and is opening up a lot of interpretation. I still believe Marvel’s intent is to highlight future events, not to put down other writers who aren’t the Architects. Does anybody ever read the spotlight issues? Or how about the dc $1 issues from the beginning of a series? That’s still elevating one product over another. Nobody complains when an even gets it’s own ad across an entire line. I don’t remember reading anywhere that Marvel said “read these books and only these books, the rest of the stuff we’re printing is only fit to wipe your ass with”.
@wordballoon – it doesn’t matter what Hickman or Parker have said in interviews, what matters is what a comic book fan BELIEVES to be the truth. Hickman says Secret Warriors is a limited series. So what? comicBOOKchris believes something fabricated in his mind. Marvel did support Parker’s Atlas. What matters is what a fan fabricates in their own minds about what REALLY happened. What matters is what comic fans read what is NOT even there as ato220 pointed out: “read these books and only these books.” Although Marvel didn’t say this, that’s what people “see”. This outrage over Marvel’s marketing really is a poor example of fandom: terrible reading comprehension.
@throughthebrush I don’t think the gender, sexuality or ethnicity of these writers comes into play at all. I don’t know any of them personally and don’t know who they sleep with. As far as artists go, generally they wouldn’t be the ones “designing” the marvel u. Lastly, I don’t believe that getting new writers will be something that Marvel will worry about. In fact the guy in charge of that sort of thing is the only person quoted in the article.
It’s essentially just “These are the guys we pay the most! Marvel’s got really good writers! Read our books!”, but done in a weird, exclusionary way. These guys are all great writers. I don’t think they need to do any advertising for them. They should be promoting guys like Dan Slott, Roberto Aguirre-Sacasa, Jim McCann and Kieron Gillen. Even if they’re not all exclusive.
Man this article hit it right on the head. All I could think of when I read the press release was how guys like Parker and Slott were thinking..’ guess we’re the jobbers.’
MARVEL’s big books are already selling..shouldn’t they big thinking of marketing vehicles to promote their lesser known books and talents ?
@Wordballoon Other Young Guns: Oliver Copiel, David Finch, Trevor Hairsine, Steve McNiven, Adi Granov.
Nice article! Re: the commenters, I don’t think there is any reason to diss the writers named in the press release, who in my opinion are all talented. I doubt they had anything to do with this announcement being made. I just don’t see what the point is in wasting publicity on a ‘rich get richer’ situation.
@iSpiderman. Is that tone really neccesary? Comicbookchris is one of the most levelheaded posters on this site. He’s not making anything up. Did you ever think maybe he could have missed 1 interview that came out? Yeesh. Plus, it’s not like his frustration is unwarranted. Marvel has cancelled a load of fantastic series. We’re all getting a little sick of it. No surprise that this announcement was met with some bile. People are sick of Marvel pushing their big books that don’t need sales. Like Paul said, “Let’s play it safe.”
Wow, Wordballoon came in and totally kicked ass! I thought that was my job. 😉
Another negative over-reactionary article that failed to properly interpret the press release, as it was pointed out in the comments. Get it right next time, comic bloggers! 😉
@KickAss I hadn’t realize we’d lowered the standard for “kicked ass” to an impotent “I’m a better reader because I ignore this” dick measuring contest.
@Anson17 – you say, “He’s not making anything up.” Yet, if you read his previous posts he actually does fabricate 2 items, something I called him on as did John from Wordballoon on a separate item. And, yes, the tone is necessary.
@iSpider. He fabricated nothing. There’s a difference between not knowing something and lying. He’s not the only one who believes that Marvel didn’t support Atlas. If it was only mentioned in one interview it’s no surprise that it’s become the common attitude towards the subject. It’s no use discussing anything with someone who uses a stream of immature sarcasm, so I’m done here.
@Anson17 – said, “We’re all getting a little sick of it.” This self entitled attitude is what makes negative articles in comics boards a horror to read. That Marvel should run their company as you want? And we thought I was un-reasonable. 😉
@Magnus – Wow, the fist shaking is getting over the top here.
@anson17 Thanks for the support, I appriciate it. However, I have learned that it is best to ignore those who go out of there way to be negative on a comic website and go out of their way to insult you personally, since their comments say more about them that it does me.
I also find it futile to argue the point with someone who believes that cancelling a series at issue #5 and relegating the characters to minis and one shots where they share the spotlight with the Avengers, X-Men, and Deadpool is their idea of support.
Actually, it is support…life support. It’s Marvel going “Sorry, you can’t tell your story and have it progress as you wanted it…but you CAN write a short mini where they meet the X-Men!” That’s SHITTY support, it’s throwing Parker a bone to use his characters as long as it’s a mini, it crosses over with other characters, or both. No push involved like this one.
Rinse and repeat with Remender and Doctor Voodoo & Punisher, and Cornell and Captain Britian.
Anyone who doesn’t think Bendis is the architect of the Marvel universe for the last eight years or so . . .
Nevertheless, I don’t find anything offensive in the press release.
Getting outraged on the behalf of others who are not outraged is a huge waste of time.
Love all the writers mentioned.
Even the “secondstringers”
Great article. Hear hear!
@comicBOOKchris – When are you and others like you (Jimski) going to understand, it isn’t “Marvel” that cancels new books at issue #5, it’s YOU. “You” cancelled the book by not buying it. They don’t want to cancel any books, they have to. If they could keep publishing every book they have to issue 500, they would. But the company is not to blame, “you” are. Whether it’s due to pirating, low enthusiasm, a small audience, or bad storytelling, the audience gets the credit for when a book is cancelled, not the company. They would publish the books if they could, they’d make more money that way. But when “you” say you don’t want it, they cancel it. That’s been the case with every title that’s been cancelled. The ensuing “overhype/Marvel doesn’t understand” talk is just annoying and cliche. So, so cliche.
@kickass. I could care less how they run their company (unless it’s actually hurting or exploiting some one.) it’s just sad to see Marvel quash so many good series. Losing amazing series and getting frustrated isn’t self entitlement, it’s just being frustrated. I use to be a strictly Marvel reader. That has changed in the last few years, mostly due to their treatment of their mid level titles where most of the best work gets done.
Accusing anyone on iFanboy as being the reason a book is canceled is ridiculous. We’re the people reading the books getting canceled. We all understand the business side and the reality of it. That doesn’t mean we can’t be bummed or frustrated when a great series disappears. Blaming the people reading it is preposterous.
Let’s get back on topic.
I honestly don’t see what’s wrong with labeling those guys the architects. I’m pretty damn sure that Greg Pak, Dan Slott, FVL, and co really don’t care about it as much as some individuals here care. It’s just a label nothing more.
@Conor Thank you
Again, stay on topic. Anything more off topic will be deleted.
seriously why Dan Slot is not one of them
and now a secret event that will involve….Ass & Hat !
unfortunately due to the tightness of todays economy marvel, like any good corporation, subcontracted out their marketing department to the lowest bidder….Hello from the Peoples Republic of China !
Keep on marching !
I don’t get this campaign. They are basically telling people to buy the books they are already buying, and to follow the creators they already follow. Don’t architects build something from nothing? Turn an idea into reality? the “architects” of the Marvel U were Stan lee, jack Kirby, Steve Ditko, John Romita, etc. Bendis, Fraction and the rest are Marvel’s top guys right now, but I would hardly call them architects. And I don’t see the point in pushing your top titles as something new and refreshing. they are ALREADY selling. Why not focus on books that have a strong core audience, but are high quality and could probably be more popular if given more exposure? (X-Factor comes to mind here.) I don’t get this at all. It just points out the fact that a handful of guys are writing all the books that sell, and it’s short changing the other writers, some of whom (Peter David and Dan Slott) are writing stories that i enjoy just as much, if not more, than those being written by the “architects.”
I’m fairly ambivalent about the whole thing, honestly. I do see the problems inherent in promoting “architects of the MU,” but I think — as Ali and John both point out — this is actually a press release about an event; it’s just one that downplays the event.
My suspicion? This is how you write a press release when you’re a company that’s gone on record talking about ‘event fatigue.’ Jumping right in and talking about the next event would seem too soon. Instead promote the fact that all your best names are working on something together.
Well, this discussion took a turn from when I last checked in at comment #5.
I agree with the article whole heartedly. It can give credence to the idea that only certain books and certain authors are worth reading. People who go to fan sites such as this one are a minority of comic book fans. Most people just go to their LCS, pick up their books and head home. When they read this book, the message they’ll get is, nothing is as important as these books, everything else we do is just filler.
Just curious, am I going to have to pay $3.99 to read how great these guys are?
Man, this really blew up. I’m (thankfully) compeletely jaded when it comes to comic book hype. Marvel hype is generally the most ridiculous. So file me under the ‘don’t really care, no big deal’ side of the argument.
I don’t even currently read anything from the ‘Architects’. Might pick up a couple of their current books in trade but otherwise I’m not interested and try to avoid $4 32pg comics. On the other hand, I probably wouldn’t even be reading Marvel comics regularly if it weren’t for Parker, Abnett & Lanning, Remender and PAD. So let them hype what they will.
Gimmicky gimmick is a gimmick. Over-titled writers now have titles. Real fans will read what the want and real fans will buy what they want regardless of hype or titles.
Couldn’t agree more! Still, you’re giving it an importance it doesn’t really have do.
Gotta say that I agree with @wordballoon more than anyone else in this thread. Is it an obnoxious press release? Sure. But what press releases aren’t? And we’re not just talking comic books.
Whatever the profession or industry, you always have annoying PR types telling you how great their stuff is. And guess what?! Their goal is making themselves look good. And when doing that, they’re going to focus on their biggest successes. Therefore you get this architect crap. It’s no different than a movie studio selling themselves on their biggest money makers. Just because they brag about Harry Potter and Transformers doesn’t mean they don’t respect their smaller earning films. But the goal is to sell yourself as a success. PR is just that. You think Apple or Microsoft is going to market their product lines around their low sellers?
It’s not about respect or some silly sense of justice. It’s about BUSINESS. Marvel is trying to tell you that they are awesome and at the top of the industy. Bragging about Fred Van Lente & Jeff Parker isn’t going to accomplish that. It doesn’t mean they don’t respect those guys. You want them to put out an enqual opportunity press release where they tell you about every single one of their great writers? Would that change anything? No.
Seriously guys. This whole ‘outrage’ is just coming off as stereotypical fanboy teeth-gnashing about things of ultimate little consequence. And really just makes everyone look ignorant as to how big business works. This isn’t some huge thing. It’s simply a case of, “Hey, how can we market Marvel as being better than DC? I know, let’s point out that we have a better stable of hot shot writers on our main books!” It’s nothing insidious or underhanded.
It’s a silly marketing ploy. And such things exist in all businesses. The only difference is that with comic books being such a small industry, you have sites such as this who get to be on the inside who give you a first hand look at how obnoxious press releases can be.
Good Lord, does any other fan bade bitch as much as comic fans? Can you imagine all this back and forth over movies and TV shows coming out? Should HBO have not promoted Boardwalk Empire as much as they did because it was Scorcrse’s show? Should they have touted Big Love more? Relax, its comics.
I totally get the frustration, but I think this, unfortunately, comes down to how you read the release.
It is clearly a badly written and concieved press release, otherwise none of this would be happening, but you don’t have to be offended if you don’t want to be. If you want to try and live you life with less stress, then it is quite easy in this case.
As the “architects” of the marvel universe these writers have, presumably, an overarching remit which will dictate the direction of the univeral narative. However, like real architects they wont have a hand in every aspect of what goes into the finished build. To extend the construction metaphor, this is where people like interior designers and sub-contractors come in and make a build into a real, functional, enjoyable (hopefully) space. Similarly your mid-list writers and titles come in and, potentially, write great stories throught the lens of whatever is happening as a whole and turn a single narative into a rich and complex universe.
Of course you all know this, but it is important to keep it in mind when reacting to a press release like this.
The insensitivity of it is not in doubt, but your reaction to it is only controlled by you. In this case I must side with ispiderman, despite the fact he went about his argument in a terrible way. If the writers not mentioned are offended, let them speak up. You are not helping anyone by getting upset about it. We all know the way the business functions and things like this are not really a surprise, if you don’t let them be.
Very nice article, Jason. Your inclusionary vs. exclusionary point is spot on.
I don’t get the whole “Don’t get upset, it is like it is, and we all know”-angle.
Sure, it’s not a big deal. But Jason is a writer. And he writes for a website that is about comics. So why not write his thoughts about it into an article, even more if it’s a well written and thought out article. Is that press release the end of the world? Is that article about pointing out the greatest injustice in comics? Sure not. But still no harm in dissecting it a little bit and going into how those press releases work. Showing how little thinking goes into them at times.
There are allready enough articles on websites devoted to comics that just function as an outlet for press releases from the publishers without reflecting on them at all.
I applaud Jason (and the whole iFanboy crew) for trying something different at times.
And this comment section needs a spellchecker.
@j206 “Whatever the profession or industry, you always have annoying PR types telling you how great their stuff is. And guess what?! Their goal is making themselves look good.”
In this case, they didn’t succeed.
@Bendrix Thanks very much. Yes, I would say the only frustrating part of this (I have no issues with someone disagreeing or not liking my article) is this dismissive, “why do you care?” It’s problematic considering I wrote the article for a website devoted to covering the comic book industry. If we’re not meant to care or react to the press release, why release it? We can’t have it both ways. We can’t be expected to “help drive the medium” and talk up the PR and hype we are into (and there’s plenty of that), but then be totally non-plussed and disengaged from stuff we don’t find well done? That’s frustratingly skewed thinking. We’re in the business of reacting to news — good/bad or, yes, indifferent.
@wood @bendrix You guys are both right, my stance on relax it’s just comics should have clearly been directed to the tone the comments section took, not the article itself. It is refreshing to have a site that isn’t just passing out press releases in the comic industry.
@Wood @Bendrix I would hope that while I may have disagreed that it I didn’t sound dismissive. If I did I apologize. But seriously, how can I take somebody with a deadpool avatar seriously ;)?
I really don’t think that anybody in this discussion has really hit the nail on the head. This press release wasn’t made for us. By us, I mean anybody that isn’t a retailer and is somebody who frequents a comic books store frequently. A lot of people who are just getting into comics have NO IDEA where to start or what is important. Can you imagine walking into your lcs having not been in one in years, or maybe walking in for the very first time, looking up at the wall and seeing 4 Thor books, 4 Avengers books, 4 Captain America books, 3 Iron Man books, 10 different X-books and then every other comic from every other publisher? I would venture to say that this press release is to inform retailers more than anybody of a way that they can explain to customers what is important. New customers will then see it right on the front cover that these are the architects of what is pushing the Marvel Universe forward in 2011. Does the writer of Amazing Spiderman need to be an Architect? I don’t think so, because when somebody new walks into a store looking for a Spiderman comic, Marvel has done a pretty good job of making sure that there is one Amazing Spiderman title on the racks. Somebody also mentioned the movies, which I think is the biggest point of them all. Fraction and Brubaker are writing the two main titles of Marvel’s biggest movie releases of 2011 which will then drum interest in their 2012 blockbuster whose two main titles are being written by Bendis. Not to mention X-Men First Class will be coming out and Fraction is also writing the main x-book. These movies will hopefully drive people to the store and the retailer can point them to these books, and then if they do their job well can sell all of the wonderful smaller titles that we all love to the people.
As for the whole excluding writers part… I have a hard time believing that this would bother anybody who is getting to do what they love for a living. I mean Dan Slott is writing AMAZING SPIDERMAN, Jeff Parker is writing THE HULK. These guys have a dream job, writing characters who they have probably grown up loving and to think that they would get all hurt about this is odd to me.
Think big picture here guys, as we will hopefully be welcoming a few more people to our hobby over the next year and it doesn’t hurt at all for their to be something right on the cover saying that this is a good place to start. The less intimidating it is, the more likely somebody will jump right in.
Sorry, but i’m gonna de-rail this thing and come off topic: Not enough people are down with people thinking differently than them. Especially commenters on this website. Thats why I stopped posting as much. To many people that are gonna talk down to you and treat you like an inferior for just thinking differently. When did everyone start expecting people to be just like them? Get off your narcissistic high horse. You ain’t god. You can disagree with the articles or other commenters all you want, but start throwing around words like “ignorant” and “reading comprehension” and you’re the reason this site isn’t as fun as it could/should be for everyone.
Why are these people are so angry? Why can’t they play nice? Why do they feel its their job to educate people on how they should feel about things? Do they just need hugs?
If you’re innocent, be cool, only the guilty are catching offense.
Hey guys, first time – long time.
First, great article, Wood.
This is the kind of “press release” that has always annoyed me as a long time reader. I refuse to believe this was a press release for anyone BUT comic readers. I also feel like every reader is an “in the know reader”. Aren’t the only remaining funny book readers still around people that cherish the medium and consume as much information about the industry as they can? What’s the alleged monthly reader number at 300K?
I also refuse to believe this press release would get any non-reader into the store, unless it was something about Spider-Man dying. (note: they should do that!)
It’s just another knee-slapper idea from Marvel in a long line of poor ones. And I’m a hardcore Marvel reader. This kind of stuff upsets me but I just rant on the Twitter about it, instead of writing a well-thought out piece like Wood did.
There will be readers that say, “nothing to see here, move along.” But, come one, this is our industry. Let us be angry. They’ll still get our $4 anyway.
of course this is marketing
why do you think you can see the employee of the month pict when you walk into a business?
It’s not just to boost employee morale or to single out achivement
It’s to tell the public they have employees who are achieving.
It’s branding- and while we all know these creators by name alot of people out there are reading the books
and couldn’t tell you who wrote what’s in their hands. They jus tknow they are reaading avengers or spiderman.
And I actually don’t think it’s such a bad idea from that perspective.
But I would agree it is kind of a slight to toher creators
But then again as you point out- it’s not like everyone working at marvel doesnt know the status quo.
Perhaps the employee of the month analogy is also apt in the sense that marvel things it will “motivate”
other creators to strive to become an architect themselves/
Who knows but this is obviously just
I have to agree with wordbaloon. I read this and saw it as “those guys you love have big new projects coming that will define the marvel universe” calling them architects seems pretty apt. If you want to split hairs over the term, i remind you that architects also design add ons, and build around older structures, and redesign older structrures. no one is saying they are the creators of the marvel universe, only that they are creating the direction that the marvel universe will take. just as Bendis, Millar, and JMS did a few years back. Just as Shooter, Byrne, Miller, Thomas and countless others have in the past and many more will in the future. Just as Johns and Morrison are now at DC. If Remender, Slott, Parker and the others want included in that, they’ll have to earn it. All of the architects started as guys with small followings and then blew up from there (primarily by selling a lot of books). I imagine the architects in a few years will have some of those names in there.
I think the negative reaction to this press relase has to do with the frustration so many feel at books that they love going away when big books keep on. I get it. Its easy to blame Marvel. Blame their marketing on pushing big books rather than small. But WHY they didnt sell is speculation. Personally i tried all the cancelled books that have been brought up. The stores I shop at stocked every one of them. Most of them i dropped. In the end I think books like New Avengers, Captain America, Fantastic Four etc were better reads, for me at least. Not because of habit not because they are popular. All of those titles have been bought and dropped over the years. I LIKE bendis Avengers book. I dropped Mighty Avengers after Slott took over. I gave it a chance, and it didnt click. Likewise Sword, Dr Voodoo Thor TMA. I did like Captain Britan, Atlas and the cosmic books but again, less than Avengers, Cap etc. Tastes vary. Ill try whatever its is Bendis, Hickman and Brubaker have coming up, but if i dont like it ill drop it like Spider Woman and Secret Warriors. Fraction and Aaron will depend on the project as i’m more iffy with their track record. And if Remender or Parker, have something new ill try that. Pak, Van Lente, Abnet and Lanning, probably not as likely as thier stuff doesnt click as well with me.
One of the problems ive seen in many podcast communities is that when a view point becomes voiced a lot, its easy to assume its a dominent view across all fandom, or worse that it’s somehow “right”. A small number of people read comics. A smaller number still are really hardcore fans, a smaller number still listens to podcasts and visits comics websites regularly, and an even smaller number posts there. When you are part of the smaller later numbers it can be easy to forget that larger first number may see things differently.
Ultimately i read the press relase and thought “ill have some big new books from Bendis, Hickman, Brubaker and Fraction to look forward to” Thats what i thought the point of the press release was. You may not have. But if you would rather read Doctor Voodoo or Thor TMA or Atlas than New/Secret Avengers then i dont think this is for you anyway. Marvel is trying to sell a few big 100,000 copy event books rather than a bunch of mid level 25,000 books (and lets face it those numbers would have kept Sword, Atlas and Thor tma alive). They arent in the business of supporting good comics (and like i said Avengers is closer to my definition of good than Thor TMS, maybe not yours) they are in the business of selling comics. And always have been. Lee/Kirby FF and Lee/Ditko Spder-man, were great, groundbreaking books. If they didnt sell they could have been cancelled and they would have tried something else.
I apologize for the lengthiness of this post. I didnt realize how much i had written until i just looked back, but i have been thinking this for a while.
Great article! It’s things like that so-called announcement that demonstrate why Marvel have fallen so far the last few years (As well as Quesada & Alonso’s notorious behaviour towards fans who ask polite questions at this year’s NYCC). To exclude guys like Remender, Parker, Pak , DnA etc was a serious f*ck up. Let’s be honest here: Post-Siege, Bru & Fraction are not on their A-game in regards to Cap & Thor respectively. Bendis is still coasting of his Daredevil days (the last impactful thing he wrote was Civil War:The Confession). Only Hickman & Aaron are holding it down from the guys mentioned. Never thought I’d say this after reading Marvel for 30 years,but, Make Mine Vertigo!
It’s not about big books vs. small books or big name creators vs. smaller ones, as far as I understand it. It’s neither a problem to promote the top sellers even more. Nothing wrong with saying “You know that awesome Bendis guy who writes that many great titel for us, he’ll come up with another one soon, at it gonna be as awesome as his other books. And guess what? Same goes for Brubaker, Fraction and those other ones whom I am to lazy to scroll to the top for”.
The problem is that they say if you want the stuff that MATTERS, go for the new books of these guys. THOSE are the ones that are IMPORTANT. Which implies two things: 1) You need those books if you want to get whats going on in the Marvel Universe, and that leads to 2) you don’t need the other books. The DON’T matter, they are NOT important. ‘Cause they are not included.
That, to me, is what Wood is saying. And I can see the problem in that.
@abstractgeek – great, well thought out post. you point out many good things.
@Wood it’s one thing to react to NEWS. It’s another to pick apart a press release about an upcoming storyline, before the story has even been described, let alone begun to take shape.
There’s a lot of judgement in your piece over very little real information in the press release .
You’ve spent paragraphs decrying the fall of one snowflake before the blizzard really begins.
That’s your right, but it’s also fair to question what all the fuss is about .
I’m not sure if anyone has said this yet, so I apologize if I didn’t see it before. BUT:
What about the artists? Are they not considered ‘Architects’ in their own right? Sure artists might bounce around more then the writers but they still have a major part in comics. People like Stuart Immonen, Chris Samnee, Mitch Breitweiser, John Romita Jr, Bryan Hitch, Gabriel Hardman, Ed McGuinness, Kev Walker, Rod Garney, and so much much more. Don’t they deserve the credit as ‘Architects’ too?
In hindsight I get what Marvel is doing here. For better or worse, these 5 writers are the biggest names for the company. But I totally agree with Wood and anyone else who say that the other writers are getting shafted here. People like Van Lente, Parker, Abnett, and Lanning are not getting the recognition they deserve.
@TheNextChampion No offense but did you read the whole press release?
“The very fabric of the Marvel Universe is changing and the Architects are the ones leading the charge! Marvel’s Architects initiative spotlights the writers and artists telling the most exciting and impactful stories that rock the Marvel Universe to its very core every month.…
Stay tuned to Marvel.com for more news on Marvel’s Architects, including interviews and the unveiling of the artists redefining the Marvel Universe! ”
Again, this is only the first PR.
This is what I mean by over scrutiny before any real details are given. Are those who are so upset by this PR looking for reasons to get mad at Marvel?
@abstractgeek Thanks for the thoughtful reply. I’m not sure if you were addressing me directly but in case, let me agree with you that we’re a niche of a niche. I think there’s a lot of truth in taking one’s personal experience as the reality of the majority; when in fact it’s often not the case. No arguments there. But to be honest, I was expressing my personal issues with the presser, fully accepting it may not reflect the thoughts of anyone else, much less the majority.
@Jig I appreciate the kind words. I do however want to make sure it’s clear I don’t agree with your statement that “Marvel has fallen so far the last few years.” That’s not a fair characterization of things. Marvel remains THE dominant comics publisher, regularly netting 50% of the industry’s single issue sales. And financially they’ve never been better off or had a broader reach. And I still adore the majority of their output. This wasn’t a treatise against Marvel, this was an op-ed against a specific marketing ploy.
So the main defense is that Marvel didn’t actually say anything in their Press Release?
Doesn’t that raise the question of why they released it? There’s a Boy Who Cried Wolf scenario they need to be aware of if they want retailers and consumers to actually believe there’s substance to what they’re saying.
I still think that Jason’s points are all very valid. And John, don’t tell me that as soon as you read the release you didn’t start looking at the calandar to start planning on how to get all five “Architects” lined up for interviews.
@wordballon: Ah, so that’s where I missed the comment….in the main article.
My mistake.
@ChrisNeseman there is no defense, because there is no offense.
again I question and disagree with the mistakes and rude slights that are being read into this typical PR by those of you who seem so offended by it.
and as for me plannning on talking to these writers in future WB eps…well no shit sherlock 😉 . Thse guys pop up at least 2-3 time a year as it is on my show. …along with Parker,Remender,Slott and FVL.
on with the witchhunt …
As I said before. It’s the use of the word Architect when describing writers of licensed properties is where this is going off the tracks. Each one of those writers are Architects, but NOT AT MARVEL! They are not building that universe, they’re rearranging the furniture.
@PraxJarvin you just made my point, by listing the “wrong moves” Marvel has made in past PRs. Sounds like you’ve got an axe to grind.
Teasing that more information is coming is nothing new in the publicity game.
YOU say it’s a non event press release?
Marvel is saying “these guys are planting seeds in their current books that will turn into a bigger story next year. stay tuned for more info.”
that seems pretty clear to me. it’s not desperation, it’s a first declaration of what’s coming up next.
again all the negative comments here are about what ISN’T in the press release, and the creators that should be included. the accusations come without even knowing what the actual stories will be about.
@ChrisNeseman as it’s been explained elsewhere in this talkback Architects do make additions to existing properties.
You are looking for reasons to be upset, when you quibble about semantics.
@Wordballoon I jus want to thank you for exemplifying Wood’s sentiment in the first two sentences of this review. Prax brought up past examples of this company’s PR practices, the two he mentions were met with a great deal of negativety from fans. Seeing as how this release is premised on nothing but past successes for these writers, how is he wrong to bring up past failures of marketing?
@wordballoon: Dismissing @PraxJarvin’s comments like that it’s just ‘an axe to grind’ is pretty silly.
The majority of people are getting quite annoyed with what Marvel has been doing lately. What with making the fans ‘vote’ on cancelling a book be meaningless (more importantly screwing around with the creative teams whether we like them or not), or sinking so to get people to ‘destroy’ recent DC books to get a fucking variant.
So you’re saying these things can’t cause a fan to be angry? Seriously?
http://www.ifanboy.com/content/articles/Negativity_Is_TOO_Damn_High
@wordballoon “the accusations come without even knowing what the actual stories will be about.” This is the problem, John. They said nothing of substance whatsoever. Don’t vilify people in these comments as being on a witch hunt when all we’re saying is that it’s a press release about nothing.
We’re reasonably critical of a publisher that puts out countless teasers to sell the product they’re going to have no problem selling anyway. All I’m saying is this: Tone it down. Put some time and effort behind the books that need the boost. Market everything, even the big titles. But don’t pay someone to create a promotional image for what ought to be in a pamphlet for the Disney people who’ve never picked up a comic in the first place. This is a superfluous waste of their efforts in a time when great books are falling too quickly with little fanfare.
No one is calling for a boycott. No one is starting a letter campaign. It’s just frustrating. So why not look at things critically?
@wordballoon Publishers constantly tease about what’s coming up and what big stories are being set in motion. Hell, that’s what half of your interviews are about! (Interviews which I love, by the way) They constantly tell us to “stay tuned” and “exciting things are in the works” and people are just fed up with all the cock teasing. This press release can be considered the straw that broke the camel’s back and I’m not sure why you feel that people shouldn’t see it as that. I personally don’t care much one way or the other, but dismissing criticisms the way you have just seems unfair.
You know that when they do an artist side of the ‘architects’ it’s only going to focus on the five that are going to be working with the writer ‘architects’. So when that press release comes out we’re all going to be upset over the no mentions of the other brilliant artists working in Marvel as well.
(There I made the artists comment relevant again! Yay!)
I honestly have no problem with this Press Release. I read most of these writer’s books, so yay for me, i get more awesome comic books… but why can’t anyone see past their own fucking ego for two god damn seconds to see that other people have a completely valid, if alternate, point of view, that you might not agree with, but that makes absolute sense?
@diebenny dude. chill.
I retract the witchhunt remark.
neeseman knows me well enough to know i’m just talking trash.
same goes for wood, with whom I do still disagree with his premise.
like I said this level of scrutiniy over a PR seems way out of proportion.
this is my last comment.
feel free to email me if you’d like john@wordballoon.com
@Wood i was not directing specifically at you, but the general sentiment expressed here and in other threads on similar topics. One of the things that got me thinking about this broader topic was some weeks back on 11 Oclock Comics, where you mentioned feeling out of touch with the rest of fandom over Scott Pilgrim. its a strange feeling, and one i was feeling myself when EVERYONE here and else raved about Thor TMA. I even went back and tried the book again after it made potw, convinced i must have missed something, and still didnt see it. When it was cancelled i hate to say there was a small sense of relief that it wasnt just me! I do recognize the quality put into the book though, it just wasnt for me.
@ChrisNeseman I dont think “architects” is necessarily an incorrect term, (technically they arent architects, true, but then many of the Young Guns were not young, and none of them were in fact firearms) while i stick to my assessment that architects do create additions, redesigns, etc, I would be TOTALLY down with this whole program being renamed THE INTERIOR DECORATORS OF MARVEL. Then maybe Remender, Parker, Pak, Slott and others won’t feel as bad, if they ever did.
I think it’s interesting that no X-Men writers or titles are mentioned on the list. I think that just shows how much Marvel has changed since the 80s & 90s.
I also do agree that this is a bad marketing ploy.
@zattaric Matt Fractions writes Uncanny X-Men and he is on the list :p
That’s an excellent look at a dopey piece of marketing, Jason.
Had to go back and look at the main points of the original article to try and figure out what this drama is about.
Point 1: Have any of the writers not mentioned as one of the creator gods complained? If not, why are you angry?
Point 2: Retailers have to sell books. Event books sell. Hyped up books by quality creators sell. Books “that matter” sell. How does that screw the retailers?
Point 3: I’ve only heard the mantra about stories that “don’t matter” from comic buyers and reviewers. I’ve never heard Marvel or DC claim that the story doesn’t matter. That is completely on the comic buying public. Marvel treats their properties, even the ones they cancel, a hell of a lot better than your average comic reader.
If you are already reading Marvel comics, specifically the ones mentioned in the press release, it isn’t meant for you. There’s no need or point to advertise to people who are already buying what you’re selling. Coke doesn’t need to release an ad targeted at me about Diet Coke, because I’m already drinking it. Marvel doesn’t need to tell me to read Fantastic Four, because I already am. Getting upset about them publicizing themselves and their big names is tantamount to getting upset at the 80’s Chicago Bulls for using Jordan and Pippen to sell tickets and not whoever the non-starting small forward was.
But then, if anyone is going to get mad at the very things keeping something they love alive, it’s nerds. Saw it last week with the Fantastic Four thing, see it here this week, and it’ll happen again next time Marvel or DC makes an announcement.
@Wood
I just meant Marvel’s quality had fallen in terms of keeping lower-tier books going & also all this horrendous hype over guys who’s sales are going great guns. Instead of plugging things like TMA or Incredible Herc, Captain Britain etc. Of course they still have the volume sales share within the industry.
Personally I am only reading one of the titles mentioned, Fantastic Four. Avengers, like Green Lantern at DC have lost all momentum for me (a non-Marvel guy). Instead I buy in issue or trade most of the books Jason mentioned. Just another cheesy marketing ploy, like the pick a Deadpool book to cancel, or even better the event 7 years in the making.
It’s an ad that says we have five awesome new series/events coming up. These events/series are super important. These are the guys who are writing them. These guys who are writing them are super good which will make the awesome super important events/series super good. Buy them!
I think (in my personal opinion) this is all that is going on here.