Comic Books

UNCANNY X-MEN #525

“SECOND COMING”, CHAPTER TEN

Things have never been worse for the X-Men. They’re stuck in an impregnable dome of Bastion’s creation. As if that’s not bad enough, inside this dome is a portal to the Days of Future Past timeline through which thousands of Nimrod Sentinels are pouring. Cyclops has sent Cable, Cypher and X-Force on a suicide mission into the future to destroy the portal, but do they stand a chance?

WRITER: Matt Fraction
PENCILS: Terry Dodson
INKS: Rachel Dodson
COLORED BY: Justin Ponsor
LETTERED BY: VC - Joe Caramagna
COVER BY: Adi Granov

Price: $2.99
iFanboy Community Pick of the Week Percentage: 2.0%

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  1. Well, it LOOKS like there will be action in this one.  

  2. Dude, there was MAD action in the last one.

  3. i might just skip this one since i haven’t been following second coming except for the issue of this series that i got

     

  4. It took me 5 minutes to realize that was Ice Man and not the Silver Surfer. I have some burning questions: Who will Wolverine make an insensitive joke about this issue? Who will lose a body part in a poorly described/shown way? Who will Dani Moonstar flip out at for no adequately explored reason this time? When will Hope do something? The last month of this crossover has been a big "Meh" from me, after liking the first 4 chapters quite a bit. I hope it picks up some here but…. 

  5. @Prax-My prediction is that Hope will finally do something once another character dies, preferably in her arms as she screams "WHY!?!?!" up into the air.

  6. @Prax Yeah, the poor Dani characterization has really been getting to me. Is she hot-headed or bipolar? She is supposed to be a possible team leader, not someone requiring protective custody.

    @Drakedangerz Oh, oh… Can the camera (in this case the panels) move back farther and farther as we look down from above? I am hoping Hope losing faith again this issue for two pages, but then gets it back again after nothing significant changes. 

    I liked the last X-Force issue, although again, Kyle and Yost would it kill you to throw in a caption or some heads on the summary page or something to let us know something about all these damn mutants. I consider myself a bit of a mutant expert and I still get confused. I can only imagine the causal reaader has no idea who the f- all these mutilated mutants are. Anyway, I thought it picked up and started moving after a couple of stagnant issues. I am cautiously optimistic going forward. 

  7. Also, does anyone know where Elixir is? An Omega level healer could really change the balance of power here, but no one seems to be noting his absence. "Oh dear, Hellion lost his hands. If only Elixir was here." or "Curse you Elixir, we need your help!" or "Gee, I’d rather have a robotic limb. Please keep Elixir away." Hela revived him and he went to Necrosha… did he stay there? Burn himself up? Go to the Himalayas to study the ancient art of mandala brain tumors? Am I missing something or is it K&Y?

  8. so does this issue follow the time travel team? the rest of the X-Men? both?

    (probably not both) 

  9. @JimBilly4-You know, @Prax and I have been wondering where Elixir has been for the past month or two. Seriously, get that lazy bitch into the action.

  10. @JimBilly,Drake: Wikipedia states that Wolverine related to X-Force that Elixir quit the team because he couldn’t shift between gold and black anymore (I’m guessing during Necrosha?). It seems that it happened off-panel. Why they wouldn’t have conscripted him for the event baffles me.

  11. Yeah it kind of bothers me that some characters do not make any appearances in this crossover. Where is Warpath and Wolfsbane when you need them? How long does it take Polaris and Havok to reach Earth?

  12. where is gambit nowadays?

  13. Another solid chapter in this crossover, I’m still really surprised at how much I’ve been enjoying this.

  14. @Prax That sounds vaguely familiar. I don’t think it was made at all clear, but perhaps Elixir can’t go gold right now and therefore can’t heal? It would explain his absence. Since they are mostly fighting robots the black Elixir wouldn’t be much help anyway. It is the sort of thing about K&Y that drives me slightly batty. They are mega-X-men continuity nerds, pulling mutants out of their butts, left and right, but they don’t take the time to drop the few bits and pieces the reader needs to keep up with all the X-continuity they are dropping in all over the place. I am sorry, I am not going to read their entire run and keep Wikipedia on standby every time I read a comic they write. One line from Wolverine or Cyclops about not having a healer because Elixir is out of action would be enough. I know if I had just had my hands melted, the lack of a healer is ALL i would be talking about. 

  15. @anthonydrum  in Second Coming Revelations Hellbound.  (Don’t bother, it’s horrible.)

     

    This was a big disappointment.  "She has my eyes!"  Whatever, blah, blah, blah.  Oh, wow, another X-Man hates Scott what a shocker.   

  16. Didn’t see the big twist at the end coming.

    You know, the one where they’re just talking, you turn the page, and apparently it’s over. 

  17. @ PraxJarvin

    Wolverine making bad jokes? Someone losing a limb? Dani behaving oddly on two or three pages? Frankly, the issues you cite couldn’t be more minor and irrelevant. Second Coming isn’t perfect, but what you’re describing are triviliaties.

    Anyway. Very little seemed to happen in this issue. The conversation outside the dome went on in circles. However, very little happened in a relatively entertaining and well-written fashion. I liked it more than the last chapter.

  18. @Bornin1142-The things Prax is describing all demonstrate a complete lack of understanding of the characters and their relationship as a family. I wouldn’t say they are trivial at all. And the fact that random people are losing limbs just comes off as pure shock value.

  19. @ drakedangerz

    You’d be absolutely right. Believe me, no one hates token deaths, shock value asspulls and meaningless arguments to accentuate drama more than me. However, I still believe that in the context of a whole story, none of these are very important. I hardly think the X-Books turning from familial to militaristic is the correct direction, but it certainly doesn’t ruin an individual story.

  20. @Drakedangerz @Bornln1142 is right I haven’t read any X titles since the end of the morrison run and I don’t care why Dani is acting the way she is I don’t care about Wolverines jokes or weirdly drawn amputations that isn’t what this story is about those are the little things that can and should be dealt with after the immediate threat is over.  To deal with them during the middle of this story would slow it down even more than it has been.  Plus it has only been a few days in X-men time for this story and being that they are being attacked by lots of Nimrods I don’t think they really have the time now.

  21. Man, still diggin’ this. The entire team of writers is really selling me on the desperate, surviving by the skin of our teeth feeling that the X-Men are struggling with, and it’s really hooking me in. Also, Hope with glowy eyes was pretty rad. Pretty rad.

  22. I loved the panel with Thing’s bloody hands….. Why is it my favorite part of this book had to do with the Fantastic Four and The Avnegers?

  23. I thought it was all around decent, but filled with cheesy moments. The Hope "You’re not my real dad" scene turned what could have been a great character scene into a cliche soap opera moment. THough Emma’s closing line saved it a bit. The Fantomex Watchmen joke left me wondering "What was the point?" (I don’t even like Watchmen all that much! Heck the movie’s over a year old, what’s the point in mocking it now?) But the worst cheesy moment was X-Force just stumbling upon the wall from Uncanny X-Men #141. It just seemed so forced. Especially Warren’s "They’ve killed us all!" scream. Which shouldn’t have been a surprise to anyone as they’d established previously in the event this was a future free of mutants. Again, none of this was bad just really corny! I will say, the Dodsons draw a pretty awesome Fantastic Four, whose presence in the book was a little unnecessary. (As was Bucky Cap’s ordering the Science Team around. "You three, STUDY THIS THING LIKE YOU ALREADY ARE DOING!") But I was a little confused by the end of the book, because it just sort of ended, and despite the dialogue it didn’t seem like a natural break. 3/5

    @Bornin @Damon Drake hit it on the head, you may not agree with them, but they’re all certainly issues I’ve had the whole gamut of X-Books in recent years. Many of the characters are acting like whackadoos who just go around screaming at each other rather than accomplishing anything. (See, Hope this issue, who really flips out at Scott for something she knew Cable was doing from last week’s X-Force. Or the lame fight between Hope and Dani monster from last month.) And my reference to the loss of limbs has more to do with the handling of how that happened (Hellion in X-Force) than the actual occurrence. You say "That’s not what the story is about" or "There isn’t time." It’s a friggin 14 chapter story about robots form the Future coming back to destroy the past, how is there not room?  

  24. @PraxJarvin Those are parts of the story that would flesh it out for old readers and be confusing and make it drag for brand new.  I’m not saying don’t cover it but this is a jumping on point for the X-books and to fill it with things that have little to do with the main story of this crossover is unnecessary. Yes most of us know that the future is mutant free and have already seen the wall before but the new reader may not.  As for the X-men acting like whackadoos…when haven’t they? The X-men have always been a big soap opera book that’s what they do.  Remember not everyone is reading every chapter so some recap has to happen otherwise some people would be lost. As for Dani Monster, does it move the story forward? If it doesn’t can it be handled at a later time? Do her actions need to be explained at all or is the fact that they are in a very stressful situation explain her yelling at an easy target?

    The only reason the Avengers and FF show up is because this is the Heroic Age dammit if something major goes down everyone shows up to try and help.

    I think the thing we forget as comic book readers is that not everyone has read the same things as everyone else and that it is okay to try and bring new people up to speed in the current book as apposed to reading a book that is almost 30 years old.

     

  25. This sucked. I can’t believe I wasted 3$ and 20 minutes of my life on this piece of shit. I’m fucking pissed!

  26. Man, I don’t know why there’s so much animosity toward Fraction on this book, but then I’m a creator guy, not a character guy, and I love Fraction to pieces from way back. That said, I’m reading this whole crossover, and it may be my favorite multi-book crossover I’ve ever read. I was only buying Uncanny at the start of this, but I think I’ll be picking up some of the other books after this is done.

  27. @DamonS23-So it seems what you want is big dumb action. While I can go for that sometimes, I don’t want that here and certainly not in a huge 14 or 15 part story. I want a story with meaning and character moments, not just moving from A to B with as little as possible in between. Like @Prax said, they have had plenty of time to address some of the concerns we have expressed. And like any other event (i.e. Blackest Night, Siege) this should not only serve new readers, but long time fans as well. 

     @Jamesschneider-Fraction is hands down my favorite creator, since Casanova, and this is easily his weakest book. It’s not horrible or offensive to me, but it’s not even close to being in the same league as his other stuff.

  28. @damon You’re making this into a old/new reader thing. It’s not. It’s a matter of the few character moments that could make this event stellar being little more than cliches. A well done Hope/Cyclops emotional confrontation could have made this issue a classic, kind of like the gentle Hope/Cable hair clip scene in the Uncanny 423. Hope just screaming "You son of a bitch" and storming off (after she was shown to be sad but understanding last issue) just don’t jibe. Dani Moonstar objecting to what Cyclops is doing could easily be handled in a better vein, even just her screaming at him, if the words had been remotely good. Or if they hadn’t just pulled her name out a hat to have a character object for the sake of faux drama and not really care if it fit the character at all. As well, these aren’t "old reader" continuity issues. It was laid out pretty clearly last issue that they were going to a world where mutants were all dead. Warren’s reaction (Just like Hope’s earlier in the issue) doesn’t mesh with that. It’s the difference in writers covering the same story beat in two different ways, just this time it’s pretty blatant. Them finding the wall was just cheesy and a personal objection and not a real problem with the issue. Look, I made a few glib remarks. They’re not things hindering me from liking the event, the writing and execution are. I’ll remember not to couch my complaints in sarcasm in the future to make it easier to understand. Those were four glaring problems I had with last issue. I’ll note neither you nor Bornin could "defend" the "When will Hope finally do something?" line. This too is just as petty a complaint, but we all know it’s true. She’s worse than Layla Miller in House of M! It’s strange to me how defensive people are about these books. Look, I love the X-Men. I’ve read for a long time yes, but I’m not going to let my love of them blind me from looking at it through a critical lens. It shouldn’t be too much to ask for solidly written, well thought-out character beats against the backdrop of the Nimrod attack. Character moments are not going to scare off new readers. That notion is silly. As it stands, I’m done with this topic. If you loved it, you loved it but know it’s not free from reproach. If you didn’t like it, know that people are going to like for entirely different reasons then you are. Simple as that.

    @jamesschneider I love Casanova, I love his Iron Man, I loved his Iron Fist and I loved his Thor "mini." But he really hasn’t been that great on this title in my opinion. I totally agree with Drake.

  29. I was struck with this issue how much I like the recap pages in modern comics. I don’t even notice them in 90% of the books I buy, but I’ve only been buying Uncanny and Legacy and don’t feel like I’ve missed anything by not buying the other titles. While I never minded missing a random chapter of a crossover when I first came on board in the early 90’s, I certainly could have used these enhancing recaps.

  30. @Prax  I think my point was being lost here everything you guys have said has been right…maybe? I think both missed the point where I said I hadn’t read X-titles in years so all of this new stuff is new to me.  For me Hope has been around for 10 issues so my anticipation for when she was going to do something can wait a little longer I don’t mind.  You’re right if they took the time to make the character moments stronger it would be better…IF I had been reading the book for more than10 issues but seeing as I haven’t I don’t really care about the vast majority of character moments in this crossover not just the ones you have pointed out.  I have no idea why beast and cyclops are fighting, I also don’t really care in the context of this story I figure I will find out later if I keep reading.  These are just my personal feelings as well. 

        I think taking extra time to flesh out characters I don’t know would alienate ME.  Why are the X-men in San Fransisco?  Where is Maggot? Where is Gambit? Since when did Nightcrawler become a priest?  When did Iceman become a man of faith? Why does Angel switch back and forth between Archangel?  Hell when did he become Angel again?  Where did all the teleporters come from in the first place? Why is Professor X walking? Who the hell is this Elixir you are all talking about? All questions that might help flesh out the story but would not make it any better for me. You are also right character moments won’t scare off new readers if handled correctly you have to give enough to make the story accessible to new readers and satisfy your older readers.  Which they haven’t done for you guys and maybe in a few years I’ll be just like you but I doubt I will stay in the X-books I’m probably just a tourist.

    @Drake Because I haven’t been reading the X-men a big dumb action book is what I’m looking for delving to much into character moments mostly serves to confuse me and take me out of the moment of the comic.  I have to disagree about Blackest Night and Siege being for new readers the vast majority of moments in those books have no effect on people who hadn’t read the things that had come before. If you didn’t know anything about the Sentry you would thing he was just some random bad guy and as for the people he killed…killing Ares has no impact if you don’t know who Ares is. The same goes for Blackest Night "Oh No! Ralph and Sue are Dead….who are Ralph and Sue?" Those events where payoffs for years worth of stories. For me these big events are all about the ending and I will hold judgment about where or not they are good until then.

      Because there is so much to know the X-universe might be the hardest Universe in comics to get into tens of characters that all have a moment or two every year and it is assumed you know it because if you don’t none of it will make any sense. Those are my two sense I hope it ends well for you because there is nothing worse than investing time and money into an event all to have it suck at the end.

  31. @DamonS23-I honestly don’t know where to start with your comments so I’m just not going to bother. Like Prax, I’ve said my piece and I’m done with this discussion.

  32. @Drake and Prax Sorry I guess I’m missing your points.  Oh well at least we have Batman 700. I enjoyed that too! 🙂 

  33. @Damon: I don’t think Second Coming is meant primarily to be a "jumping-on point" for new readers like you. If you find it accessible and enjoy it, great! But the event is really a conclusion of the over-arching story of the X-Men since Messiah Complex (or even House of M, depending on how you look at it). Just because the "character moments" don’t mean anything to YOU, doesn’t mean they aren’t important. The book is not being written for you personally. The intended audience, as always, is X-fans. Plus whoever else they can get interested in the books.

    Anyway, I agree with @drake and @prax that some of the X-writers have missed/squandered a few opportunities with moments that didn’t quite ring true. (Dani vs. Hope in the cafeteria.) That said, these few missteps have not been ruining the X-over for me. Overall I think this story is pretty strong.

    THIS issue, however, did not quite do it for me. IMO, Fraction didn’t do anything to move the plot along. The entire issue was spent reinforcing the status-quo of X-Men fighting Nimrods under the dome/other Marvel heroes trying to get in/X-Force in the Days of Future Past timeline that was established by the end of the previous chapter. The situation at the end of this issue wasn’t any different from what it was at the beginning. Meh. 3/5

  34. @jbagree You are right, but you have to start again somewhere and seeing as this probably leads into the Heroic age for the X-books I thought I would try it out.

  35. @Damon: Don’t get me wrong. As a fan of the X-books, I’m glad you’re jumping on here. In my opinion this X-over has (mostly) been the best X-Men story in quite a while, and if it’s working for you that’s awesome. I’m just saying that you – as a returning reader – might not know who Elixer is or care why he’s MIA. But he’s been a major strategic asset for the X-Men in recent years, and it’s totally valid for people who have been following the books to question his unexplained absence. So while I see why something like that wouldn’t bother a new/lapsed reader, you can’t project that perspective onto everybody.

  36. @Jbagree Once again you are right.  I just know for me it would have been more confusing to mention characters they weren’t gonna use but if the guy is as important as you say he should be in the book not just a mention.  I don’t think I have projected my perspective onto everyone else I was just stating my feelings as a new/lapsed reader and have been told I’m wrong for feeling the way I do.   The things that people wanted to see expanded and fleshed out should have been, but now it is to late we are in the 3rd act of the story and now it’s time to start resolving things adding more strings to the story now COULD(not will could) weaken the over all story.  Once again I hope it ends well and everyone gets what they want. 

  37. Stories like this may not be meant to bring in new readers to the x books, but they are intended to introduce readers of some x books to the rest of the line. I only buy Uncanny and Xfactor normally. This gives me a chance (or forces me depending on your take) to read the other books and possibly start picking them up. I think that is the PRIMARY reason for the crossover to be structured like this. to boost sales of the lower selling books up closer to the numbers of the main books, at least in the short term, but possibly longer. For that reason i think they are careful not to put too much into this story beyond the story beats that need to be there. I dont know who Elixir is, so answering where he is would have been a wasted moment for me. I dont read New Mutants so I dont see any issue with Dani’s characterization. Those to me are small details that dont impact my enjoymanet of the work. Unfortunately i think marvel is less concerned about appealing to people who already read the wide line of books. They probably assume they have you already in their clutches and the small things wont drive you away.

  38. @Damon: I’m with you. What I want from this month’s X-books is a satisfying conclusion to those story elements that have been included in this x-over. I was just trying to express that – just as you aren’t wrong for feeling the way you do about the series – those people who are bothered by these details aren’t wrong either. It doesn’t seem like we really disagree on that.

    @abstractgeek: I wouldn’t argue with any of what you say. You’re right that – from a marketing perspective – Second Coming isn’t aimed at those of us who already read Uncanny, Legacy, New Mutants, and X-Force every month. Furthermore, I happen to agree that in a story this big it’s best not to sweat the details.

    I can just see where some people who, like me, do read X-Force and New Mutants would be scratching their heads at some of this. Particularly why, with all the injuries, the group healer isn’t even mentioned. And "Not everybody reading this reads X-Force or knows who Elixer is" doesn’t answer that question.

  39. @Abstractgeek I, too, only read Uncanny and X-Factor. I’m aware of the characters from having been a fan of the books for years. As I’ve said countless times here, the issues are not those of continuity but of bad writing. No one is demanding umpteen scenes with Elixir sittng at home watching the news, just a quick, throwaway line saying "This obvious plot hole has been plugged." As well, I’ve not suggested anything be added! I’ve only ever suggested that aspects could have been better! As well, I have no issue with people enjoying the book or not, that’s not the point. 

  40. This was better than the last few but…this still feels weak. Maybe it’s because I know vampires come next and that just bores me to death.

  41. @Prax It’s only an obvious plot hole for those that know the character exists. You are right thought a simple line wouldn’t hurt.

  42. That last time I read X-Men, Cable was running around with little baby Hope. Now I come back, and she’s all grown up!

  43. Let’s not confuse "character moments" with X-men continuity explanation. Explaining where Elixir is or what is Archangel/Angel’s present power set are X-men continuity. Having a believable interation that rings true and is not cliche is a character moment. I fully agree that there needs to be a minimum of X-men continuity nonsense. The X-verse is immense and dotting every ‘i’ and crossing every contiuity ‘t’ would drag things to hault quick. However, K&Y love throwing in tons of obscure X-characters (and killing them). If they are going to do that they need to throw in a little more explanation of who the bleep these people are and why I should care they just got incinerated.

    Fraction’s problem is that he just doesn’t get these characters and therefore he seems incapable of writing scenes where the characters voices ring true. This issue was one of the worst in a while in terms of lines and scenes that just jarringly clang, pulling me out of the scene. I actually liked the overarching story, but every character moment failed for me, really pulling me down. And I don’t think I am just being an X-nerd, demanding Fraction’s interpretation match mine. The scenes just read like he doesn’t have much of interpretation of the characters. 

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