Tonight’s episode: Daybreak Part Two & Three
Last week’s Entertainment Weekly had a great oral history of Battlestar Galactica. I love Edward James Olmos. This his is recollection from when he was approached to play Adama:
The very first creature I see from the Black Lagoon, I’m going to faint on camera and I’m off the show. That’s it. You can just write that Adama had a heart attack and died.
And if you feel like giving the brain a nice little jolt before the show starts, check out this chart of the Battlestar Galactica‘s timeline. That’ll give you something to think about for a while.
A quick programming note: Tonight’s final block of episodes is two hours and eleven minutes long.
Speculation, theories, reactions, live blogs, you know the drill.
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Where my toasters at!?
WHat time does it start?
Not 8 I hope I’ll not be home till 8:30 and I didn’t set it to record NOOOO!
I had plans to meet up with a friend, but then I remembered this was on. He’s in town tomorrow, too. He can wait! :-p
Once this is over I’ll have nothing I watch on a regular basis anymore.
@CAM: 9pm EST
It’s on from 9:00 – 11:11 EST.
Those 11 last minutes will just be EJO eating KFC, downing booze and crying. 😉
I haven’t been this keyed up about an episode since end end of season 4 of Babylon 5.
So do you think they will meet the cylon god or something? Also how many more times will we hear all along the watchtower?
Special guest star Bob Dylan as the cylon god!
I just want to see their magical still that turns algae into whiskey. Also want to know the odds of hearing the phrase ‘ramming speed’ before it’s over.
The only reveal I care about involves a Daggit named Muffit.
@Paul – didn’t they attempt to introduce a kid and pet in the mini-series? maybe we’ve been missing the key all along…
Show me the muuuuuuuuuuuuuuffffffffffffiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiit!!!!!!!!!
The progaming vp lady said they wouldn’t go for any dogs. Maybe we will see the lawyer guy and his new pet dog one last time.
here we go here we go!
Hmmm…Canada’s Space channel better show all 2h11m. The programming guide doesn’t look promising though.
start
Oh, gods, here we go…
I think the CAPRICA prequel should star Baltar’s dad. I’d be there every week.
"Try it! You’ll like it!" – hahaha
I see we’ve been watching Sopranos reruns before writing this ep.
I can totally see Tigh being the out of control drunk at the strip bar.
I’m gonna miss you the most, Saul Tigh.
I think… I think… Apollo is adopted. His brother, I can see being Edward James Olmos’ son.
@Conor – I was thinking the same thing.
"One of my students." Awkward.
But hot.
Oh, Laura Roslin you naughty girl.
marine reporting for duty
"I wanna hear it come outta your mouff!"
@Paul: During one of the commercials, click on the link up top that links to the oral history of the beginning of the show. There’s a funny anecdote about when Olmos and Bamber met and Olmos was like "So you’re suppoesd to be my son?"
Okay, Starbuck is definitely the kind of girl you do NOT want your brother or friend dating.
Oh lovely, good thing I finished eating 5 minutes ago.
I did not need to see that.
That was…. okay, wow.
Adama is perhaps the most glamorous role on television.
My 21st birthday was way worse, but I did end up on the sidewalk like that.
Was it just me or did Olmos look like a muppet. Meep meep meep.
Tip for alcoholics. When seated, make sure you’re leaning forward, not back.
@SamMacBastard That made my day.
@Conor – Cool, I’ll take a look. It’s weird. I only just started watching BSG a year ago.
Is Sam Rockwell remaking 2001?
Hmmm… a look at CAPRICA later on. I’m not totally sold on that show yet.
Don’t make me cry, Doc Cottle! Don’t make me cry!
We are gonna be minus two wonderful growly voices after tonight. A moment of silence for Adama and Doc Coddles gravel throats.
Doc Cottle, the greatest of all men.
I’m going to miss the "If" tag line for Sci-Fi when they change to SyFy later this year.
And man, what a great uncomfortable Doc Cottle farewell. I’ll miss Doc Cottle the most.
Doc Cottle is awesome.
Doc Cottle is my favorite supporting player.
Hoshi’s in command?
Its a good thing that the Colonial Fleet doesn’t have a don’t ask don’t tell policy.
Luckily, the Cylon colony isn’t concerned with a threat from a small, one-man fighter.
I always knew Tricia Helfer was thin, but I never noticed how thin until she stood between Tory and Katee Sachoff.
Also… the hell? Hoshi!? What about that awesome female Captain?
i read somewhere that all tears were real.
Why did they give Sam a full body hot wax treatment?
When Anders first appeared I never thought I’d see him like this in the final episode.
@bigyanks: Yeah, Olmos said his emotional scenes were real.
Best President Ever?
What the hell!? Is this Rag-Tag Guest Star Promotion Day?
The Scarlet Cylon.
I’d watch a spinoff with Admiral Hoshi and President Lawyer on a Basestar.
Haha President Lampkin and Admiral Hoshi. The fleet is fracked!
I don’t see how Galactica survives this last mission. It’s about to break apart at any moment as it is… a heavy firefight against the cylons… I don’t see it surviving.
Okay…. that was a chilling scene.
The guy who freaked out over a dead cat. Yeah thats who you want as the leader of the remnants of humanity.
I really wanted to Tigh to pass on XO to someone and then ceremoniously give them his eye patch.
the not mat lawyer guy is president. humanity is doomed
I was expecting a ‘OH MY SCIENCE YOURE NOT IN MAH HEAD!’
@Sam: People love their pets, man. Especially in a high stress environment like that where your pet might be one of the few connections you have left to your past and your humanity.
Did anyone give out a ‘hell yeah!’ to seeing that they are going to bring the rebel Centurions with them?
i think the people who will miss BSG the most are the ad wiz’s at KFC.
Holy balls that’s close!
i don’t know if it’s the eyepatch but tigh sounds more like a pirate each episode
C’mon Sam starting hacking!
Wow… they’re putting Roslin in a logical position on the ship. Not thrusting a gun into her hand.
THE MUSEUM!
x on the forehead? just use a bullet.
Love seeing the classic cylons.
"What does this X mean? Why is there an X on me?!"
"……perfect attendance."
Holy balls an internal jump!
Was not expecting that.
Ramming speed!
Is the end of this going to be like the end of 12 Monkeys? Like Roselyn is Bruce Willis.
I’m scared now with the speach
@conor it would of been badass if sam somehow powered up the old cylon with his mojo.
Holy balls that’s a lot of Raiders!
LETS DO THIS!
You know you’re evil when your ship looks like a fucking arachnid.
Operation Stick our Junk in a Hornets Nest is go!
holy shit it was the Aggro Crag.
I… don’t think Galactica is going to last very long…
ouch
I think HBD is way ahead of the pack.
I think the female hybrid just came.
"Ok so Anders is going to cyber fuck the hybrid and while she’s distracted …. "
Oh man, oh man, oh man…
This is so exciting I can barely breathe.
@Jarett
Great minds think alike.
they just answred the unversal question, boybots are better then fembots.
They must have been saving up the FX budget for the finale.
I fear for Hot Dog’s safety.
@conor me either.
First Raptor battle of this half of the 4th season!
Am I ahead of you guys? Dang. I’ll try to delay my "holy balls"s.
@conor in the same article they said the production company saved most of the budget for the last episode.
So only black guys dead so far I can’t help but notice.
@HBD: Looks like you’re three minutes ahead of me.
This looks like a 100 million dollars.
How is "Helmets off and stand in front of hte Centurions" any kind of strategy?
@bigyanks They learned their lesson on effects budget from DS9. The last battle there was minaly stock footage. Artfully reused stock footage, but stock fottage none the less.
You’d think with the massive decompression happening, they’d keep the helmuts on.
I can’t wait until Dean Stockwell gets it in between the eyes.
Wow, the scope of this battle is amazing. I hope all the people who have been complaining about the lack of action this season are thankful they saved up the money.
CLASSIC CYLONS! This episode is blowing my mind!
oh shit old school cylon!!
"You betcha, Gailan." LoL.
"I think you overestimate their chances". Awesome!
Digital paper!
Oh Cavil I’m gonna miss you third or fourth most.
HOLY BALLS!!!!!!
@Conor I am a little bit,
It’s direct to DVD!?
Wow, Caprica actually looks… interesting?
HEAD PEOPLE!
wow. didn’t realize caprica would be available so soon on dvd
Esai Morales… Eric Stolz… and Trixie in CAPRICA? Hmmm. I’m not sure I understand the point of the show, though.
WHAT THE BLOODY HELL?!
HBD….you’re like really ahead of us.
im on the interested boat.
@Conor Neither do I. And I’m really not that sold on it.
Quantum Leap is on Netflix Instant Watch, so I won’t be missing Cavil!
well caprica rates a what tge frack
I have the book that comes before that book!
Boomer!
Guys, Caprica is about love beyond reason or something. What else do you need to know?
wheres our KFC commercial?
@ Conor its by Espensen so it’s gonna be about freaky violent sex.
I wonder if Cavil is going to be living inside a giant opera house.
Trying to not read any of HBD’s posts as he’s significantly ahead of everyone else.
new cylon just did a three stooges on the classic one.
Caprica looks like it will have it’s own identity rather than just being a prequel to BG.
Wouldn’t a BG movie be awesome?
Oh arterial spray!
I might start deleting HBD’s posts.
I wonder how long the effects guys have wanted to do a New/Old Cylon fight.
SamMacBastard is ahead of everyone too.
WTF!
Adama’s inferno.
Even in the face of armageddon…Baltar is schemin’ on some ass.
Sorry, not our fault. 🙁 I’ll quit posting.
Alright alright I get it. I’ll wait a minute or two before I make my cracks and comments.
"hey guys my bad, can i have a do over?"
Katie Sackhoff pulls off the bad ass thing very well.
how ironic she shot up her uterus.
Does Starbuck have Hera’s song notes on her left arm or is it blood/oil that just happens to be in a set of ordered dots?
Adama, do you ever NOT drink?
You know, this scene of Boomer doing this would have been better served earlier in the season. Here it feels a little forced. (To you know, show it after the fact.)
If Roslyn was her Grey’s Anatomy character she could’ve saved that man.
@Jarrett: As long as no one touched her.
@Prax – I dunno. It’s common device to show an important character moment after the fact. Makes it more tragic. Makes you second guess.
@Paul: Like seeing the Bruce and his dad moments after Thomas was killed in BATMAN BEGINS. Breaks your heart.
how are people ahead of us?
If they ever do another re-imagining of this show it should be called ‘Ghettostar Jivelactica’ . Adama will wear a large Flava Flav style clock that shows how far he’s gone through and call it his ‘Adameter’
That’s a good example.
When is Tory going to buy it? She’s owed a bullet.
@SMB it was done a while ago, it was called homeboyz in outerspace.
I wonder if they sold that giant hybrid tub at the BG store. That’s pimped out.
Oh Baltar you big silly.
I’m not cryin’. It’s just been rainin’…. on my face.
@conor I was more or less in agreement with Paul until you mentioned Batman Begins. :-p
@SamMac
I’m going to see Conchords next month in Nashville. Pretty excited.
HELO!
NOOOOO! HELO!
Guess he’ll never find the Dollhouse :(.
Well, now he’s free to go over to Fox to get canceled.
Oh boy… it’s Opera House time.
oh shits its playing out!
@Prax – How about that scene in Buffy stabs Anya with the sword (though she doesn’t actually die)? And it cuts to the musical flashback?
Hera is like R2 D2 at the beginning of A NEW HOPE.
Shit, I was typing. What happened to Helo?
Al needs a bullet more than Tori does.
@Paul There we go! I don’t generally like it as a device, though. And I love non-linear narrative.
I love the way Dean Stockwell is channeling Vader here.
GOOSEBUMPS!
On BATTLESTAR GALACTICA, dreams really do come true.
this is the gretest music ever.
This episode is everything I hoped it would be and there’s still 1:11!
super adama
Wow, this is like when Hot Rod got the Autobot Matrix of Leadership from Optimus Prime thus fulfilling the prophecy.
Hi I’m fruition. Can I come in?
I have a sneaking suspicion Space is trying to fit the extra 11 minutes in the same 2-hour time frame. That’s why some of us are ahead. Sorry about the spoilers.
WOW!
@ultimatehoratio You got the touch! You got the powah!
Its interesting that both sides are led by Atheists.
Baltar!
In Ron’s Morgan Freeman voice; "Shoot THAT mothafucka"
That looks like a pretty clear shot to me.
Wait, is Baltar saying that god doesn’t have a rooting interest in who wins sporting events?
@conor Only Triad.
Remember when the credits said "They have a plan". I don’t think they ever did.
You mean he’s not getting one between the eyes??? Aww man…
Now shoot the toaster!
Everyone into the truth pool! FRAK YOU TORY
go baltar
This finale has ticked all my boxes.
Hmmm… another hour to go…
Chief is so going to kill Tory.
So what’s just happened for you guys?
Just desserts time for Tory!
The five are just dipping into the tub now.
Jeez Torey we all know you give bj’s to all the viper pilots, calm down.
They just now stuck their hands into the pool.
still an hour to go…wow
CHIEF SMASH
Oh, boy – the Chief is going to kill someone!
HOLY SHIT!
My eyes just bulged out of my head. I had to pop them back in.
Cavill is awesome…though I still think someone should shoot him
wow…weapons hot indeed
Ship’s not supposed to bend like that, I don’t think…
…said the joker to the thief
wow… this is… wow. Stuff is so happening.
Is Chief Tyrill gonna have to choke a bitch?
Trust in Bob Dylan.
non-crazy cara thrace is cute
Kara jumped them to the nearest Starbucks.
EARF
So, Starbuck is an angel?
HOLY SHIT AGAIN!!!
wow…look at Galactica wobble
"Oh so this is Super Duper Earth"
Starbuck is the daughter of the boxed cylon and a human, right?
Is this past Earth?
I still have my fingers crossed that its’ Star Trek Earth, and they are about to be hailed by Starfleet.
the chief has finally had it
HOLY SHIT!
I think they’re in 1977 and are going to join the Dharma intitative
I can’t belevie they all didn’t just die.
@conor Are you telling me the Cylons are the ones who asked for Whales?
@Captain Primate I think you’re behind us.
@Horatio As far as we can tell, yes.
But damn… this has been.. wow.
do we think its a past earth? Africa seemed to still be intact.
C’mon, dinosaurs!
I think that they’ve jumped into the Galactica 1980 (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Galactica_1980)
Kinda surprised noone died on that mission.
And they get eaten by a tiger…
Damn, too late for dinosaurs.
@horatio Moore went on a 5 minute discourse in the latest commentary podcast that Kara is NOT the daughter of Daniel. But he also was adamant that Kara had died last season and wouldn’t be coming back. So take his words with a grain of salt.
@Jarrett oh, don’t worry…we’ve still got 40 ish minutes to go
I think we’re going to get a kind of SIX FEET UNDER ending.
I am disappointed that I can’t live blog because I just realised just how bloody far you all are behind. It’s been fun though guys.
So they’re… where? Earth’s past?
I’m waiting for Richard Attenborough to show up and go "Welcome… to Cro Magnon Park!"
@SamMacBastard: It took you 90 minutes to realize you were five minutes ahead? 🙂
holy crap…we’re in "Aliens built the pyramids" territory here
@Ultimateharatio maybe not past but a new dawn of civilization of earth.
seriously, will the centrions know what the hell to do with themselves?
That’s really, really depressing.
so, are people in agreement that Cara is an Angel? And that her "father" gave her the coordinates?
@ Conor nah I am like 15 ahead of you. We are getting shorter than normal commercial breaks so it has been an increasing difference. I have been keeping so much back. I wanna discuss afterwards when I know I won’t dash the experiance.
off topic. @paul what do you think of the Disney earth movie?
So Bob Dylan is a direct decendant of Starbuck?
Seinfeld & Sopranos final episodes, this ain’t.
I like the idea of All Along the Watchtower being written in one civilization, remembered in a future generation, then passed on to a new one. Celebrated, forgotten, and then newly discovered and popularized after thousands of years.
Well, we still have Stargate…
Wow, what are they going to do with all of the time left?
Regarding the Disney Earth movie. Hopefully they don’t mass murder Lemmings in HD this time.
@bigyanks – The repurposed Planet Earth? Not sure.
Horse and cart is going to be a big change from the Galactica, Bill.
last viper out
I’m gonna cry.
I’m really impressed with how all-out they went with this episode.
Classic Series Theme!
This actually explains the dog tags I dug up in my backyard the other day.
Classic Galactica theme!
we’re gettin’ a Return of the King kinda ending here.
Chief is Highlander.
Classic series Theme?! Holy shit am I ahead.
It DID happen to Ellen. YOU did it, you creepy old pirate!
@Sam now you’re about 3 minutes behind lol.
We have a little over 30 minutes left, Sam
Crap I’m gonna cry again.
I’m pretty sure Tigh could swing a stripper threesome here.
I can guess who invented alcohol ….
POLAR STORM!!!
I’m pretty sure that this stuff was either shot in the grasslands of Alberta or Saskatchewan. Northern Plains represent!
@Ghazzi – Hahaha…
Yeah only 15 minutes left here.
Oh man, theory time.
CHIEF IS THE FIRST HIGHLANDER.
Tigh was the first pirate. Ellen the first skank…
Tigh has a reall cool wife to hang out with him in srip clubs.
also only chimieing in during the adds is fun
Phew, withheld against crying the second time. I’m still a man!
wonder if the Chief is going to leave his girl with that wanker Hotdog?
@Jaret
Scroll up I said that too. lol
Apollo was the first emo song writer. Starbuck the first musician.
Also… I’m guessing Helo is dead? We haven’t seen him since being shot nor heard about him.
@CaptainPrimate: It’s not his kid!
@PraxJarvin: Apparently so, he was bleeding out when Hera ran away.
Baltar = the founder of all religion.
Grow your mustache, Bill!
Crappit! Again with the crying?!
@ultimatehoratio we really do think alike.
Oh no is Bill going to fly her into the sun???
im starting to get emotional now.
@conor he raised her….just because hotdog donated the sperm, doesn’t make him father
Adama: "let’s go scare some Neanderthals!"
They better establish a barber soon, or Lee is going to have some seriously big hair.
Apollo invented abandonment issues.
I knew Kara was a pidgeon!
what a skank.
Hmm. If that was Helo’s last hurrah back in the corridor, I’ll be upset. He deserved more.
We couldn’t have slipped in I "double daggitt dare you?"
This ending makes no sense.
I am making old comments now.
@HBD: He saved Hera. He blocked the bullets.
@HBD agreed…though, I think we’ll see more…because they didn’t really resolve the Hera story
My angel is a centerfold.
@Jarrett: They are finding ther own personal peace.
waaaaaah?
WTF>
Okay, who HASN’T abandoned Apollo?
WHAT!?!
She *was* an angel.
@Paul
There’s your pigeon!
last minuet theory they are all dead and are in purgatory.
@ultimatehoratio: Whomever is appointed therapist is going to have his hands full with Lee.
Mmm…Miss Laura Roslin just don’t know!
yup…and her father was god…sent her with just the right info
I wish a woman would do that to me just once.
Man, sexy cougar Roselyn with a heart o’ gold!
Starbuck = Jesus figure.
"At screening of finale of BSG with cast and crew–this is…awesome" – Mike Romo via Twitter
Lord help them. Baltar is the only one with an agricultural back ground.
wow…little choked up here
Hands on the wheel, Bill.
andddd crying
where the fuck is Baltar?
BSG Movie of the Week: Head Six and Head Baltar are crime fighting angels in grity 2009 New York.
You know, I seriously could not have predicted this ending.
@byanks
Meanwhile, Baltar has scored with 3 pygmies.
I kind of want the series to end with the Lorne Green voiceover.
Nice.
@bigyanks he’s off bangin’ neanderthals
My mind has been blown. And Sam, remember everyone else is still 11 minutes behind us.
I want this series to end with the full orchestral version of the original theme.
Olmos directed "The Plan".
What the hell was that promo for?
The Plan?
Helo made it!
Helo!
there he is…Helo my man
YES! Helo’s alive!
And that’s the last tribal drum credits theme I’ll ever hear. Sad now.
Two hour BG movie directed by EJ Olmos. "The Plan".
Mommy’s gonna have to teach hunting because Daddy’s a bit gimpy.
@ultimatehoratio im with you on the music.
@conor that was a promo for the cylons planned parenthood.
ha…funny Baltar
And here’s where Obi Wan’s ghost shows up.
Hey guys it’s been fun doing this. Is there anything to replace this with? Two and a Half Men maybe?
baltar really is on the stumpy side
@ultimatehoratio: I guess if there’s a movie we’ll do that, and then DOLLHOUSE on Fridays.
She’s got about 6 inches on Baltar. In real life Dudley Moore is the only one who could score a chick that tall.
He buried Roslin next to Kirk?
@horatio If you’re looking for something with soulless robots that are trying to wipe out humanity, I think American Idol fits the bill.
Starbuck…. Starbuck the Grey , they called me that once….. I am Starbuck the White
Whoa…
OH SHIT
Oh man…. (Ron Moore!).
It’s Earth-2!
Ronald D Moore!
so BSG was about Angles?
wow….niiiiiiiice
I don’t think God approves of that dress, Six.
Fuck me.
Uhh, thanks for ripping off the end of Doctor Who’s "Bink."
so, are they saying that cylons are the fault of the japanese?
I predicted months ago it’d end on a time-jump. I was thinking more of like 100 years, but 150,000 works too.
That’s a perfect way to end!
Wow.
Cool.
LMAO at the robot montage. i have no idead what to think of that ending.
now that’s and ending and hedrix
Well done, BSG. Well done.
great ending…really great.
I think this immediately goes up with some of the best series finales ever.
still hendrix? i would rather have gotten the orchastra of the theme song. hmmmmmm
I think Ronald D Moore should give a writing credit to Bob Dylan.
@conor agreed…unbelievably impressive. cathartic, compelling, thoght provoking
we should have seen the movie "the plan" i think before the ending.
Really liked that. Not looking forward to the negative fallout from fans wanting more explicit information.
The guy who did Sopranos is kicking himself right now.
@ captian seconded
well folks…end of an era…don’t think we’ll ever see something like this ever again.
Everybody now!
So say we all!
SO SAY WE ALL!
SO SAY WE ALL
@paul but that ending didnt explain anything? i want my money back.
i loved the ending i just wish it wasnt a lead in to our present.
so say we all
@captain: Agreed. We’ll never have this recipe again. Oh no.
Wait, that’s the wrong song…
One thing: what happened to Xena Cylon?
It’s interesting to me, but you know this technically means Classic BSG is in continuity with the series!? It’s all happened before!
so in this galactica all 13 tribes are our ansesters
@yamiangie actually, they were making the argument that Hera was the so called mitochonrial eve…so we’re all descended from her
Thanks iFanboys for doing this. Thanks everyone who has live blogged on here, you reshaped how I viewed this season! It’s been real.
ciao everyone
thanks to Conor for being here with us 90% of time. It been real guys see you in the smallville thread.
so we are never going to see a live blog like this again are we?
Good blogging with you guys. If you’d like, please join us in liveblogging DOLLHOUSE starting next week.
I guess there are the others that the iFanboys run, but I don’t watch any of those shows. In fact, until SGU comes on later this year, there’s no show I watch on a consistent basis. And since Caprica is apparently direct to DVD I’m guessing no live blog there.
@vamiangie: Possibly for the LOST finale… although the BSG liveblog has been the most popular overall, so probably not.
@horatio: Xena stayed back on Earth Prime, to try to figure out what happened.
And I almost busted a lung holding back from posting when the Five took a dip in the Truth Pool. That was beyond epic.
@Paul: That would mean I’d have to start watching Dollhouse.
Thanks iFanpeeps for this, it’s been a great five years.
I actually look forward to liveblogging Dollhouse. Big potential for laughs.
Well folks it’s been a giggle but I dunno if I can do Dollhouse. Saw the first episode. Don’t think its my bag. However I am down for LOST.
Just finished it, very satisfying, teared up a couple of times. So say we all!
My head exploded. That was insanely good. So say we all.
sigh, can’t believe its over, one of the best finales ever, still, sad now.
Do a BSG podcast!!!
WOW! That was an amazing finale. I just wish I could’ve seen it live. Because I live in Germany, I have had to watch this season through iTunes.
SO SAY WE ALL
i always came back after the time shifted eps to read your live comments afterwards. sincere thanks to all the posters!!
I second that emotion for a BSG podcast!
Great FRAKING end. Just really really good. SO SAY WE ALL!
Post show Q&A with Ronald Moore.
Lots and lots of good and interesting stuff in there.
Awesome finale. I’ve been really hard on this show, but that ended pretty nicely.
All that interview confirms is that Moore really didn’t have a clue of what to do and was making stuff up as they went along. I watched the Last Frakkin Special after this and RDM said that he didn’t care about plot… That it’s about the characters. Hmmm.
"Kara, I think, is whatever you want her to be."
"There’s loose threads and things that don’t quite work."
GMAFB. Moore really is a boner… especially by putting himself in the final scene. This interview pretty much encapsulates a lot of what I hate this show has become. The whole Starbuck thing is what really gets my goat. No explanation… a ghost that picks up a gun and kills people. OoooK. There was absolutely no indication that Kara was anything but a real person. But now, we’re supposed to believe that she was an angel or ghost all along? But she did real things. She moved objects, she was the one who jumped the ship, but wait, she wasn’t real? OK, but if she was a ghost all along then why was it such a struggle for her to find the coordinates for New Earth?
I thought the finale was really solid save Starbuck, which unfortunately, was the biggest mystery.
Why can’t ghosts use guns?
@OddsBodkins So any creator who appears in their work is a boner? Grant Morrison, J. Michael Straczynski, Brian K. Vaughn, Robert Hewitt Wolfe, etc.? That’s shaky logic.
Also, Moore has mentioned he wanted to use the "Angel" beings that appeared in the classic series, but couldn’t think of a good way of doing it. They shared some aspects with Head-Six/Head-Baltar but they could also have an effect on the real world (Head-Starbuck?). But the series is, essentially, what you make of it.
However, I just remembered a few weeks back in the live blog I called Starbuck Cylon-Jesus. And that’s more or less what she is.
So, Rosslin brought cancer to earth, thanks a lot.
@OddsBodkins: 99% of TV shows are made up as they go along. Things change, characters change, actors come and go… this is how it works.
And the show *was* about the characters. That was the entire point. Character exploration.
Battlestar’s Ratings Blowout
Los Angeles (E! Online) – Goodbye, Farewell, Ka-Ching! Friday’s Battlestar Galactica two-hour series finale scored an estimated 2.4 million viewers—the show’s biggest audience in more than three years, Sci Fi Channel said today.
Compared to Battlestar‘s third-season finale 100 years ago—well, March 2007—its fourth and final finale was up a whopping 56 percent.
Only supernerds would know that was Moore in that scene.
That’s why I hate Martin Scorcese movies.*
(*I don’t.)
Josh also hates Alfred Hitchcock and Rod Serling.
And Spike Lee.
@Prax – I think it’s completely unecessary.
@Conor – I do agree that you don’t have to always know where you’re going with a show — but you better know why you went where you did. Moore didn’t need to know in the beginning that he was going to kill and bring Starbuck back from the great beyond, but he sure should’ve known what she was when he brought her back. That’s where I’m coming from. Just saying she is what you want her to be is the biggest cop out there is. Cavil shooting himself was completely irrational as well. Then we find out in the special that Dean Stockwell thought it would be cool to shoot himself… so what happens? Moore says, "eh, why not?" Even though it makes no sense whatsoever, it’s more romantic and another easy way out. If only they cared about the characters AND the plot, this could have been one of the best series finales of all time. Still, it was light years better than I was expecting.
@OddsBodkins: We’ll just have to disagree then.
on the other hand, I really don’t like M. Night Sh….not gonna work here anymore.
or that annoying guy who appears in all those Woody Allen movies.
this was awesome. what are some other candidates for ‘best last episode’? i love the last black adder.
@josh: whoa! do you seriously not like alfred hitchcock?
You see how that was a joke right?
@John42 I believe Star Trek: The Next Generation’s finale episodes is oft lauded as one of the best series finales for a show. Probably the "best" finale episode is M*A*S*H’s, as that is the most single episode of a TV show ever.
Personally my favorites are:
1. "All Good Things," Star Trek: TNG; 2. "What You Leave Behind," Star Trek: DS9; 3. "Fall Out," The Prisoner, 4. "Chosen," Buffy the Vampire Slayer, 5. "Daybreak," Battlestar Galactica, 6. "Mirror Image," Quantum Leap; 7. The final episode of Newheart, 8. The final episode of the Mary Tyler Moore Show, 9. "Sleeping in Light," Babylon 5; 10/ "Unending," Stargate: SG-1, 11. M*A*S*H; 12. Final episode of St. Elsewhere.
I think Cavil offing himself fit his character, even if it was Stockwell and not any of the writers that came up with it. Humankind was so far beneath him, like a dirty parasite, and there was no way he’d let a fracking human put their hands him. So, the only other option was the gun to the mouth.
And as for Kara, "absolutely no indication that Kara was anything but a real person"? Other than the fact she burnt her own corpse, right? 😉
And as for creator appearing in their work, don’t forget that old creepy guy in almost every Marvel movie. Don’t know why they keep putting him in cameos.
@Prax: And Angel’s finale. I’m enjoying After the Fall, but the final scene of Angel was the perfect end.
/cry
I hope that all Television can learn from BSG. A show is better with a planned end.
American films and tv get too caught up in explaining everything. If you watch a lot of European movies and particularly Asian films they just let the story play out without getting bogged down in trying to explain everything to the audience. (Anyone else a fan of Takashi Miike?) I appreciate that they didn’t come right out and tell us what Starbuck was.
@ultimatehoratio: Apparently, we decided as a nation that ambiguity was a bad thing, so was drawing your own conclusions. I must have been out of the country when the memo went out.
@Ultimateforatio I too liked that they didn’t explain it. The thoughts rolling around in my head of what she may be are way better then if they spoon fed the answer to me. The only thing about the Starbuck situation that made me sad was that she and Lee never got to be together in the end. It seems like every man that she loved got screwed in some way shape or form.
@conor: I’m as guilty as anyone. I used to get very angry at The X-Files.
It’s a very American phenomenon. If you watch, for instance, an Asian horror movie and it’s American remake. The Asian original is more concerned with atmosphere and ambiguity while the American version is concerned with plot points and making the audience jump.
Casting aside all frustration/elation for a moment… let’s have a plot discussion:
Was Starbuck supposed to be an angel/ghost the entire time or just after she "died"? She mentioned that she learned the song from her father which turned out to be the coordinates for Earth2 so how did her father get the song? Is Kara supposed to be Zeus or Jesus or Mickey Mouse? Because she wasn’t the harbinger of death the hybrid said she was. It seems to me they literally used Deus Ex Machina to get themselves out of so many tight spots they wrote themselves into. Kara, Head Baltar/6, etc.
What do you guys think? Who/what is Kara and what’s the deal with her daddy?
@conor It’s a well established convention that Ameircan literature and popular culture is heavily dependent on clear cut stories, fully explained, with clearly defined good guys and bad guys. Whether this is true or not of the individual, it is clear from what stories dominate our culture exhibit these characteristics. In many ways the British influence on our literature, music and eventually comics has slowly countered this. Shows like Lost or BSG could not have been made, or at least been successful, before 1980. Indeed, Lost is a direct successor of the British show "The Prisoner" as are quite a high number of comic books. But I’m in full agreement with you that I’m mystified as to why everything in every story most be 100% explained. I will say certain stories do require having everything spelt out, but not every story.
@OddsBodkins I’m of several minds on the subject of Kara. I think in one regard, they’re supposed to be "agents" of the Higher Power in the universe, including Kara. We don’t necessarily need to believe that Kara’s father was given this song by "God." It can be said that "God" simply used a song Kara would remember as a way of communicating his plan. Therefore, Kara’s "Head-Dad" could simply be "God" facilitating her remembering the song. Also, there’s no reason to believe, as Baltar speculates, that "God" is in anything other than a force of nature in the universe that provides kismet/dreams/memories to facilitate the creation of life. I know that’s not clear, but like I said, I have about three equally valid theories of how Kara, the song, etc. work in the series. A curious thing would be to go back and look at all of Season 4 and see if Kara actually uses her gun to kill anyone. Because over the past season, she was never strictly responsible for killing anyone. (Romo Lampkin kills the guy who hurt Anders, if I recall).
Anyone else have other theories?
Ditto.
Pretty late to jump in here, but I finally saw it & thought it was awesome, it was very ambitious ending & if it’s real — we are all part cylon. *gulp* . Character-wise, if that was the main goal of the show to showcase them, then it’s a win. The endings & mini flash back for all the characters were great & was a fitting end to a brilliant show.
There is some massive plot holes though, or maybe it’s just stuff that I missed. Maybe they’re not all plot holes, but just questions I have. Feel free to help me out here BSG fans. 🙂
1. I can accept Starbuck was an angel, & even that the Six that Balter always saw was an angel too, but what was up with the Baltar "angel"? How could he see an angel of himself if he’s not dead?
2. If they travelled back in time, wouldn’t they know it? Wouldn’t they know the geography of Earth. considering they had just been there recently? Wouldn’t the ships computers have records of things like that?
@WadeWilson I’ll try to help out here as best as I can.
1. The "Head" Six and Baltar are not necessarily the souls of who they look like. They’re representations using a form that "God"/The Higher Power thought would help facilitate the real Baltar and Caprica Six in their protection of Hera. From one perspective, it can be seen that ever since the fall of the Colonies, "God" has been setting the pieces for the humans to mate with the cylons, create Hera and bring her to New Earth to create life anew. An interesting idea is that Helo is "Adam" and that Athena is "Eve." (Funny, in that being a Cylon, Athena was created by Man; Eve is said to have been created from man.) So Baltar could see an idealized version of himself, the one that Caprica Six sees, as a way of finalizing the union between Human and Cylon. Starbuck becomes a little problematic, but I would say she is what Bill Adama, Lee Adama, Leoben and Helo need to reach the end of their journeys, so "God" sends her back to do so. I was a little sad that we never got a final Kara/Leoben scene on New Earth.
2. There was no time travel involved in this series at all. Kara jumps them to our planet at the end of the series because "God" taught her the coordinates. However, this is not the fabled planet named Earth that they had already encountered. This is a new planet in the early stages of development. However, this planet fulfills the prophecies that had gone before. ("A dying leader will lead them to Earth," etc.) When Roslin asks what Bill Adama calls the planet, calling it Earth is a bit tongue-in-cheek. He’s both joking and serious – joking, in that they already found Earth and how depressing that had been and serious, in that, for all intents and purposes this was the idealized Earth they were looking for from the Series start. It’s important to remember that the series, as we now know it, has "always" been set 150,000 years in the past.
An interesting side note to this is that the opening narration of the original series would seem to "support" the theory of how life here began: "There are those who believe life here began out there, far across the universe, with tribes of humans who may have been the forefathers of Egyptians, or the Toltetcs, or the Mayans. Some believe there may yet be brothers of man who even now fight to survive somewhere beyond the heavens…" What’s curious then is that the original series, with that last sentence, technically sets itself in the future of the events depicted in the new series! As we know, a mantra of the show has been "This has all happened before, it will happen again." Just a fun coincidence I noticed that makes almost too much sense. (The Galactica 1980 show has the Battlestar arrive in our year 1980, where that crew infiltrate and try to settle in.)
Hope that helps Wade, and anyone else lurking on here!
Here’s another RDM interview to chew on.
So is everybody okay with this unrelatated Battlestar movie? I’d be down for it, especially if they use the original theme. I friggin’ love that.
"Los Angeles (E! Online) – Goodbye, Farewell, Ka-Ching! Friday’s Battlestar Galactica two-hour series finale scored an estimated 2.4 million viewers—the show’s biggest audience in more than three years, Sci Fi Channel said today. Compared to Battlestar’s third-season finale 100 years ago—well, March 2007—its fourth and final finale was up a whopping 56 percent. So, Was Battlestar the Biggest Sci-Fi Friday Show Around? No. For one thing, Terminator: The Sarah Connor Chronciles was bigger (3.7 million, per Nielsen stats as reported by MediaWeek), and for another thing so was Dollhouse (4.1 million). Terminator was up a little from its performance last week; Dollhouse was about even."
–A huge ratings uptick means, of course, the finale was viewed by people who hadn’t watched the show in a year or two. And what a treat that must have been for them. "Wait, WHAT?"
–Sci-Fi is crowing right now about ratings that are 1.7 million viewers below those of Dollhouse, which is praying its fingernails hold out. What a difference a network makes.
My theory is Ron Moore was the GodHigher Power of the BSG universe. He was the force behind the scenes leading them to their finally destiny. I realize that’s a little obvious in a very duh kind of way. But I mean that in the sense that he was the actual story element that they referred to as "God." It came together for me at the very end when Angel Six mentions God and then Angel Baltar says something to the effect of "you know he hates that name." For half I second I thought maybe they would explain this more in the Caprica series but then it dawned on me why would God hate that? And then it just clicked for me. He and his writing staff was literally the hand of fate for the characters on this show. That and the fact that in the special Ron Moore literally said who cares about the plot its all about the characters. Which ultimately is why somethings don’t get explained. Which wouldn’t have been so bad if the week before the promo hadn’t said the truth will be revealed. So that’s my theory and it makes sense to me.
I was a bit ‘meh’ about the finale. I loved that they used the orginal shows theme music and there was some exciting bits… but the "Here Comes Mr. Jordan" Angel bit made me want to wretch. That last scene where they are walking around in present day like rejects from "Topper" was not for me either but I did like the ending images of robots with "All Along the Watchtower" playing.
By the way sign me up for a continuation of the original BSG.
Confession: I wouldn’t recognize the original theme song if it came up and slapped me in the face. I know zero about the original BSG.
@conor I probably wouldn’t give a monkeys about the original if I wasn’t 7 when the thing came out and glued to the TV when it premeired. Although having said, that I do still enjoy watching it.. and it’s worth noting (Unless my memory is faulty) in the last original Battlestar Galactica episode, Starbuck essentially dies and comes back as an Angel too. Although they are less clear about that in the original.
@conor
The original "movie" was actually pretty good for its time. You can catch it on hulu.com I think.
Is there a rotten tomatoes for tv? I’d like to see what the consensus is on the final episode.
@Prax – Thanks, mate. You helped with question one, a lot, but now I’m more confused about question two. lol.
The more I think about the final episode the less I like it. Making them all angels just seems too easy of an explaination, because now anything that doesn’t fit or doesn’t make sense the answer can just be "that’s what God wanted". For example, if Kara was an angel all along, what about her raptor she came back in? Was that the ghost of her raptor that crashed? I personally think originally Starbuck was written to be the final cylon (harbinger of death etc) & they changed thier minds.
I’m confused about there being no time travel. I thought the singularity near the cylon colony sent them back in time. If this didn’t happen, can some one please explain the burnt out & destroyed Earth they found at the end of mid-season 4 break? Was that the planet that original final five cylon creators came from? Why did they call it Earth, just to confuse me? 😛
I had always thought this show was set in "our" future (like Star Trek) & the 13 Colonies came from Earth (I’m sure they said this?) … so, I was wrong? Guess I’ll have to watch it all again from the start.
There was no time travel. The series took place 150,000 years ago. There was another planet named Earth (not OUR Earth) that got blowed up real good so they they didn’t stick around, and Adama decided to name this new planet Earth. That’s really all there was to it. ‘God’ gave Starbuck the coordinates to jump to this new planet through a song (All along the watchtower)…
But you are right they basically got out of a lot of questions by saying God willled it. I didn’t enjoy that conclusion.