PraxJarvin

June 17, 2013 12:41 pm This doesn't really add anything to the conversation and is information you've already supplied in other locations in this thread.

June 17, 2013 12:02 am While it certainly has happened before, none of it was the logical conclusion of a character arc. In this film, we're never treated to a scene of *Superman* saving anyone before the action set pieces. We get Kal-El saving people, but we also get Kal-El being a vindictive prick. In Superman II, beating up a guy who beat you up is kind of petty, but somewhat balanced. Costing a guy thousands of dollars of damage and possibly a livelihood because he poured beer on you, even though he was a scumbag? That screams sociopath. It's meant to be a funny moment, but it's bizarrely out of character (Outside of being featured on Superman is a Dick) Coming back to Superman, we're treated to someone who is pushed to the extreme. Only, we've never really seen him at normal. He's learning during the film or full throttle, nothing in between. It's been, like, three days since the truck incident? This is still that dick guy. It doesn't weigh on the audience that this is a guy who struggles to save lives, a guy who does everything possible to save lives, this is a guy who gets off on juvenile pranks (The logical thing would have been for Clark to go from the bar to the boat, that's growth! Not properly using your powers to realizing there's a better way). This is also a guy who, moments after getting blood on his hands - and seeming conflicted about it, is making out with his girlfriend, literally, on the pulverized remains of cars, buildings and people. It's the whole package that's souring people and the death is the tipping point. It's worked for, perhaps even earned, in the film, but Clark never learns the lesson of fighting for a better way in the film. It's the only way he's given and that's how he does it. It comes off as sad, pitiable. Not hopeful or inspiring. In Superman returns, the deaths are incidental to the action. (Treated in the same manner as to how in Into Darkness a bunch of henchman are wantonly killed for no reason by the people we're rooting for!) Is it right? No. But it's a stock part of hollywood. "Explain how these guys were prosecuted? Or... have them fall off this thing and assume they died as an indirect action?" The Zod issue aside in the Donner films, there are quite a few scenes of Reeve apprehending people. We don't get that here. Heck, Superman can't save anyone but Lois in this new film!

June 16, 2013 11:35 pm Well said. I felt a lot of these things, too, but you crystalized some of them.

June 16, 2013 1:59 pm Those tentacles were very Brainiac design inspired. I assumed there was going to be some type of Brainiac setup with the World Engine and the flying Computer things, but we didn't. (Which, those computers on Krypton and in the ship kind of reminded me of the white snake things from Prometheus).

June 16, 2013 1:10 am I look at it this way. How many people knew Batman's identity by the end of the Nolan Franchise? It's a fairly high number for Batman (in a world with a solo Batman.). Granted, many are dead, but it happens fairly early in Begins. One of the few good scenes in Green Lantern is that balcony scene with Hal and Carol where she figures out who he is in five seconds. Iron Man does it in the best way possible that fits the character and it's toyed with the public persona in 2 and 3. In Amazing Spider-Man Peter's pretty loose with it, if not always his fault. You raise valid points about it, though, which is what I was curious about reading. I both liked and was a bit annoyed by the quickness of Lois figuring it out. Felt more like something for a second film.

June 16, 2013 12:17 am Topic for discussion: Secret Identities seem to be over in the superhero genre. Do we like this? Does it make a certain amount of sense? Or is it now overplayed?

June 15, 2013 10:01 pm I thought that was weird. I assumed Colonel Stabler (who was surprisingly not Lois's father!?) was going to be given the moment of naming him after his awed expression in Smallville. Something akin to "You're like some sort of super.... man." I think there was a Nolan-influenced effort to "reduce" the absurdity of the genre by keeping the name minimally used. However, we end up with Kal-El getting the moniker off screen as it were. It struck me as odd. The interrogation room scene is cute, but it actually draws more attention to the name then less!

June 15, 2013 7:38 pm Not only where they launched via penis into another ship with connected to another ship which went through what I can only assume is Babylon 5 jump gate, but.... they were simultaneously held within the phantom zone within a black hole. Just so... overly devised. I can only assume that the Kryptonians wanted to punish them by making them outlive the planet. Which... more or less proves Jor-El's points. Pure Bred Kryptonians are really aassholes.

June 15, 2013 3:41 pm Well said, you hit it on the head. The only scene that approaches that in this movie is that magical moment of Perry, Jenny and Steve in the rubble. It's a stock scene, but it works so well in the scene. Only, Superman didn't inspire them to do that. He's no where to be seen. They relied on themselves to become greater without him. It's tonally at odds to the film, but it hammers home a point that the script otherwise forgets about.

June 15, 2013 3:38 pm I'm assuming there was a lot of Planet stuff that was cut. But you're right.