Special Edition Podcast

07.13.2008 – ‘Hellboy II: The Golden Army’

Show Notes

iFanboy Special Edition Podcast: – Hellboy II: The Golden Army

Josh, Conor and Ron gather to discuss the sequel to Hellboy, Hellboy II: The Golden Army

Total Running Time: 00:18:59



It’s no secret that we here at iFanboy really love Hellboy.  So it should come as no surprise that we are all really excited to see Hellboy II: The Golden Army!

The first movie wasn’t a huge success, but it was still a success.  And director (and huge Hellboy fan) Guillermo Del Toro has tons of critical heat coming off of him after the acclaimed and Academy Award winning film, Pan’s Labyrinth.  So while we were a little surprised that this movie was greenlit, we weren’t shocked.

Just from the trailers it looks to be much bigger and much bolder than the first film which was much smaller and self-contained in scope.

And really, was there ever a more perfect pairing of actor and role?  Ron Perlman was born to play Hellboy.

Are you going to see it? Of course you are! So let’s talk about it!

If you haven’t seen the movie yet be forewarned – there be SPOILERS ahoy! So don’t scroll down any further if you are sensitive to that kind of thing.

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Comments

  1. Caught the midnight show this morning and it was SO much better then the first one.

    The original, while good, still seems very awkward and unsure..but this one was just fantastic. It seemed like everyone in the movie was having such a fun time playing their characters.

    Can’t wait to see it again!

  2. Crin Crin says:

    I totally agree. This movie was fantastic.

    My only criticism was that some of the monsters looked too much liked the ones from Pan’s Labyrinth.

    This is a must see!  

  3. BrianBaer BrianBaer says:

    I’m looking forward to this. I loved the smaller scope of the first film so I’m not sure how the broad mythical feel will work here. But if anyone can pull it off, it’s del Toro.

  4. Whenever a movie comes out that I’m really interested in, I get some friends and watch marathon of related works. This line-up this time is:

    Chronos, Mimic, The Devil’s Backbone, Blade 2, Hellboy, Pan’s Labrynth, The Amazing Screw-On Head.

    That’s a whole latta movie watching.

    Too much?

     

  5. Tork Tork says:

    I’m now convinced they need to do a BPRD flick with the whole gang.  This movie was great.  Kraus was absolutely hilarious.  How many times do you hear in a movie "Suck my ectoplasmic schwanzstucker!"?  Not enough, I say. Yeah, this movie was just fantastic all around.

  6. Wow, I Dont know why people loved this film so much…..I thought it was medicore to piss poor.

    Let me say this first; fighting? great. Pearlman? Fucking good Hellboy. Effect? Awesome

    2 things bugged me about this film and it killed the whole experience for me.

    1) The acting in this was poor, as a film in itself it is not good. It’s way to sappy towards the end and it feels like I’m watching a bad soap opera. Especially the people playing the Prince and Princess. Ugh, who told them they could act? Plus someone needs to tell me why Selma Blair is a good actress; she’s terrible in anything I’ve seen with her.

     SPOILER!!!!!

     

    2) What the fuck was Mignola and Del Toro thinking about adding kids to this? Sure their not on screen, but having Liz pregnaut?….WHAT THE FUCK!? As a continuity buff and overall Hellboy fan, it pisses me off. I can imagine Ron or anyone else seeing this have a ‘Loom of Fate’ moment like in Wanted. No fucking reason to mention or add kids to a series that has no romance with Liz/Hellboy to begin with. I started to get less annoyed by this relationship from the first film; but damnit now I’m pissed again about it. I dont want a third film, cause now the ‘destroyer of worlds’ Anung Um Rang (or however you spell it) is going to have twins!…..again what the fuck!?

    I felt like I wasted money on this. Even if your a big Hellboy fan like me, I wouldnt recommend seeing it. I wasn’t worried at all about this film being bad…..but now that this did turn out bad for me…I’m really worrried about Dark Knight now.

  7. Conor Kilpatrick conor (@cskilpatrick) says:

    This film doesn’t follow the comic book continuity, it has its own continuity.

  8. @conor: I know that, I know this has nothing to do with the comics. All I’m saying that with Del Toro as a huge fan of the comics….You would think he would notice that those two dont date and make out with each other. So where did he get the idea that these two should be in a relationship? If anything it should be Abe and Liz…cause I thought Mignola was hinting at in the in the comics.

    Still…..you were groaning over the mention of kids? Or the pop like music playing during certain parts? Or the soapy, melodramatic love/death scenes? Or…..god there’s just to much of an overload of negative thoughts on this film.

    It’s a shame cause there is a good film in here, somewhere I think…

  9. Conor Kilpatrick conor (@cskilpatrick) says:

    @TheNextChampion – Things change from one medium to the other.  Hollywood likes to have the lead be the romantic hero.  It’s no different than in GI JOE when Scarlett went from being Snake-Eyes’ girlfriend in the comics, to Duke’s in the cartoon/animated movie.  They like the hero to be the one to get the girls.

  10. NealAppeal NealAppeal says:

    I had a good time watching this. There were a few things that didn’t work well, a few things that were groan inducing, but over all I liked this a lot. The troll market was totally awesome. Drunken Abe Sapien was great. The fighting and the creatures–great. All things I went to the movie hoping for were there.

    Quibbles–the romance between Abe and the Princess was really forced. The ectoplasmic man’s over the top german accent bothered me (Seth MacFarland? I know he did a funny german fish in cartoon, but come on! Why not hire a real German?), maybe worse was his over the top asshole boss personality (I get it, you’re a jerk), and worst of all was the child hellboy with the bad voice over (an adult woman doing a kid’s voice in cartoon works, but it does not work in live action).

    But despite all that it was pretty awesome. There were things I didn’t like but there was never a point in the movie where I wasn’t having fun.

  11. Tork Tork says:

    Yeah, you could tell the Abe/Princess plot thread was just there so Abe could throw the crown to the Prince and kick-start the Golden Army fight.  That was pretty forced.  I think that was mostly the fault of the Princess who felt very unemotive through the whole thing, though given it led to the "Can’t Smile Without You" scene, I can forgive.  Seth MacFarlene was pretty over-the-top as Kraus but I kind of liked that, given it too led to some pretty good scenes like the locker fight.

  12. NealAppeal NealAppeal says:

    @Tork "That’s Krauss, with two S’s" "Oh, SS, I got ya." My favorite line in the movie.

  13. OttoBott OttoBott says:

    Saw it tonight, thought it was really really good. My only complaint is that I wish there were more non-stop explosions, yelling, violence and general loud noise to drown out the a-hole teenagers that were sitting in front of me. Aside from that, it was great.

  14. I’m shocked no one is generally pissed off about the mentioning of kids in this film. We all hate the Flash’s kids in his comic. Plus we all know kids are just a desperate attempt to add ‘interesting’ elements to a tv show or film.

    It sounds like a total nitpick, and there’s more to the film which I didnt like, but that is the #1 overall thing I hated about this film. Having Liz and Hellboy together? Fine, conor mentioned it above that you sometimes need a hero to have romantic involvments, and it’s not as annoying after watching the first film again. But there was no reason to add kids to the mix in this series. Considering no relationship is in the original comics what so ever! So if there is a third film, get ready for some male or female hellboy’s running around…….*hangs self*

  15. Eyun Eyun says:

    @TheNextChampion – You’re worried about The Dark Knight? Blasphemy, dude! ;)

  16. @Eyun: I’m only worried because this and Dark Knight were the two films I was looking forward to the most. Stuff like Iron Man and Hulk surprised me on how good it was, but this month was (for me) going to be the best month ever for a comic book nerd.

    But now that this film was underwhelming in a lot of areas….I’m concerned whether this film will be good or not. I know all reviews so far state it as ‘the greatest film mankind will ever see’….I dont know, I’m just scared now that’s all.

  17. Neb Neb says:

    @TheNextChampion~  I don’t think you have to worry about the kids because I’m pretty sure this is the last Hellboy movie, unless they pass it off to a different director and a different actor.  Del Toro is signed on to do two Hobbit movies back to back, and Pearlman himself has said he’s getting too old to do these sorts of heavy action movies. Even if they did a third one with kids, it might be fun to see them relationship between them.  Also, if they did a third one, it might be fun to do a prequel, that way they could still capitalize on the franchise while skirting the kids issue.  Either way, I think it just gives an audience a chance to experience a different kind of Hellboy.  

    Overall, I had a blast with this movie, and thought it was an excellent piece to go with the first movie.  This makes me want to read all my Hellboy stuff again.  It was funny, action packed, and had great effects.  Big thumbs up.

    I bet Paul had a nerdgasm when Krauss came on-screen.  Real talk.

  18. limegintonic limegintonic says:

    Saw this movie today with my daughter, and really enjoyed it. Wonderful characters and storyline too. If you liked the first film, you’re sure to love this one.

    They sure left it open for a third film, but I can’t imagine anyone but Del Toro or Pearlman being involved. 

  19. thebouv thebouv says:

    Saw this yesterday with wife and friends and I thought it was great.  Kid-version of Hellboy was the only thing I didn’t like about it — he looked ridiculous.

    Scene with Hellboy & Abe drunk together = pure awesome.

  20. OttoBott OttoBott says:

    Harry Knowles said Del Toro was talking more Nazis for the 3rd movie (so it sounded like a prequel, maybe?), + Bruce Campbell as Lobster Johnson.

     …

     That would be cool.

     http://www.aintitcool.com/node/37388

     

  21. I dug it.  Was it a true adaptation of the source material?  No.  Was it a Damned entertaining film in general?  Yes.  I will admit that I would prefer a truer Hellboy film adaptation chock full of eldritch horror and deadpan comments.  But it was still boffo in an elseworlds sort of way. 

     

    Oh, one last thing.  I noticed a startling lack of Nazis. 

  22. Eyun Eyun says:

    @TheNextChampion – Relax, dude. I love me some Hellboy books, but from what we’ve seen so far, The Dark Knight is a different beat entirely.

    Have faith, brother. Trust in The Nolan, The Bale and The Ledger! :)

  23. There’s a lot to love in this movie and a lot to hate.

    Troll Market, Love-sick Drunks, and the Action was great.

    But the script is pretty bad in a lot of places. I liked the gothic melodrama of the elves, but the romantic dialogue was so damn sappy. And the ultra melodramatic score did not help. And Kid Hellboy was terrible. This was one of Elfman’s weaker efforts.

    But I’ll still buy it on dvd because the End battle was AWESOME. I loved Kraus taking over one of the soldiers.

  24. daccampo daccampo says:

    Saw the movie tonight. This was DEFINITELY a Del Toro flick more than a Mignola flick. Big, sweeping romantic adventure… as much about relationships as the mythical adventure. The acting had a few odd moments, as did the script. It’s honestly a little tough to get used to a Hellboy story that’s SO much about emotions.

     

    But all that said: Really Good Film.

     

    I can’t believe people are complaining about kids. Whuh? It’s only a pregnancy in this film. And even if they did another one with kids involved… who cares if there’s a kid? Does it ruin the Hellboy comic books? No. As long as it’s a good story, it doesn’t matter. The comics are still the comics.  And the general audience doesn’t read Hellboy so it won’t matter to them.

     

    If you judge this movie on its own merits, it’s most definitely about a band of freaks trying to find love and acceptance in this world. And an enjoyable take, at that.

  25. Tork Tork says:

    With Hellboy, there’s obviously a lot of gothic horror/pulp adventures stories that the first movie pulled off well.  But there’s also a good deal of funny and absurd "I’ve been drinking with skeletons/the boy has eaten the pancake, he will never come back to us now" side to the universe that I think this movie showcased that side of the mythos well. 

    As far as the movie not being close enough to the source material, the script was handled by Del Toro and Mignola himself. So if the creator of the source material obviously thought the movie’s script close enough to the source material, then that is good enough for me.  If Mignola isn’t bother by Hellboy/Liz and kids, neither am I.

  26. Conor Kilpatrick conor (@cskilpatrick) says:

    ‘Hellboy II’ catches fire with $35.9 million debut

    LOS ANGELES – Superheroes battling inner demons often rule the box office. This time, the superhero was a demon as "Hellboy II: The Golden Army" pulled in $35.9 million to debut as the No. 1 weekend film.

    Universal’s "Hellboy" sequel, starring Ron Perlman as the red-skinned devil fighting for the good guys, took over the top spot from Will Smith’s superhero tale "Hancock," which slipped to second place with $33 million, according to studio estimates Sunday.

  27. Neb Neb says:

    Hmm…that doesn’t seem to be a good take, considering it has to battle The Dark Knight next week.  Hopefully more people will see this through word of mouth because it really was a lot of fun and really good movie.

  28. OttoBott OttoBott says:

    Yeah, I’m pulling for enough for a 3rd, hopefully. Still, a little less then half on it’s first week, plus Sunday isn’t over plus international takings hasn’t been added yet. Not too shabby. Still, it needs to make a lot of money this week because as you(Neb) said, it’s gonna get hammered next week.

    Upon further examination, it got a full $12 mil greater then Hellboy1. Soooo…here’s hoping.

  29. Eyun Eyun says:

    Did anyone else notice Conor’s comment when ranking this summer’s comic book movies?

    Ron: "Iron Man was the best one"

    Conor: "Iron Man was… hmmm, well… so far"

    Anyone else think the iFanboys have seen a certain film the rest of us haven’t yet? 

  30. MHundred MHundred says:

    Conor twittered a few days ago that he and Josh had seen a screening of the dark knight

  31. rayclark rayclark says:

    just saw it tonight. i LOVED it!!

  32. Tork Tork says:

    I’m halfway surprised that the opening and ending song wasn’t "Can’t Smile Without You."  Heh.

  33. TLederz TLederz says:

    Josh feels the same way about Delt Toro as i do about Alan Moore.

  34. Kory Kory says:

    Iron Man’s still the best movie this year…at least until July 18th

  35. Tad Tad says:

    @Tork

    "As far as the movie not being close enough to the source material, the script was handled by Del Toro and Mignola himself. So if the creator of the source material obviously thought the movie’s script close enough to the source material, then that is good enough for me. "

    Although Mignola cowrote the story, it was with an understanding of Del Toro’s universe being different than his own.  Liz and Hellboy have a relationship in the movies that would be creepy in the comic but Del Toro mapped out an arc that he felt was necessary to give the movie version more substance and more appeal.  Mike is fine with artists and writers taking entirely new takes on his characters.  His favorite stories in the Weird Tales TPBs are those that are the most different from his own vision while the fans seem to prefer the stories that are closest to Mignola’s. 

     There are a few times when he vetoed ideas that he felt would hurt his comic world, most notably Lobster Johnson.  For budget reasons, Del Toro wanted to replace Johann with LJ.  The problem was, it wouldn’t be the LJ in the comics who’s a thirties pulp hero it be some guy operating today with mediumistic powers.  Sees more people see the movies than read the comics, Mike felt that Del Toro’s Lobster would become the defining one.  So instead, Johann was redesigned to what you see now which is cheaper than all the suit rigging and CG needed to keep him closer to the comics design.

  36. Tad Tad says:

    BTW, although I’ve talked to Mike about all of the above.  You’ll find all that in various interviews he’s given leading up to the movie release.

  37. I hope we see Lobster Johnson in the next film, and it better be a prequel. I’m sorry I just cant see another sequel with KIDS and a ‘cheaper by the dozen’ like tone of a film like you guys said on the podcast. We should have a past Hellboy story with him and Abe, and somehow get LJ involved with the story. Why not do Conquerer Worm as a film? It wouldnt be hard to add Herman Von Klempt and somehow make it work without Roger.

    Or better yet, make it a sequel…..Get Liz out of the picture, like she’s taking care of the kids, and make it Hellboy and Abe and Johann and LJ. That way we can have an ending when the Worm goes inside the suit of Johann and they gotta decided to kill him or not. That film would work!

    But if Conor has no problems with seeing little boy and girl Hellboy’s running around in another film….Dont say I didnt warn you pal.

  38. Conor Kilpatrick conor (@cskilpatrick) says:

    @TheNextChampion – I never said I’d have no problems with kids in the film, I just said don’t indict them for something that hasn’t happened yet.  There are no kids in this film so I’m not going to complain about there being kids because they, as of yet, do not exist.

  39. CP CP says:

    Seeing Abe and HB sing Barry Manilow while drunk was worth the admission price alone.

  40. Tork Tork says:

    @ Tad– Yeah, that’s true, but I think if Mignola was okay with the changes from the canon, that’s all fine with me.

  41. I think the twins idea actually has a lot of story potential. The spawn of Hellboy would be the rightful Heirs to the throne of hell. Once hell’s minions learn of the children, their wiould likely be a movement for one of the children to take up their birthright and plunge the world into the apocolypse.  Who knows how many other interested parties would come out of the woodwork to gain influence over these 2 kids. Perhaps the two children would feud over the thrown. Or perhaps one will follow the light and apose their simbling for the sake of the world.

    Or may be they will just hang out and watch cartoons all day.

  42. A little piece of Fanart inspired by the movie. Hellboy is hard to draw.

    [IMG]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v608/DoctorCollosus1/Hellboy01.jpg[/IMG]

  43. First want to say have been loving the show for a long while now, you guys are not only part of a my weekly podcasts but on my own little piece of the podcast space you guys freguently get Best in Podcast because you do some of the best damn comic reviews in podcast.

    Having said that I have to tell you that you guys were cracking me up with the Kip Adotta review of Hellboy II.   Kip Adotta has this bit where to says in his neighborhood people would insult you but add on a disclaimer as if it negated the insult.  For example, "Your sister’s a prostitute, but not that I mean anything bad by that."  "You wife is butt ugly, but I mean that in a nice way."  "Your kid eats like a starving moose, not that it’s a bad thing."

    That’s how your review sounded to me in places.   I just imagined  Kip Adotta with you, "That pop movie stunk, not that I’m saying the movie was bad or anything."  LOL. 

     Don’t get me wrong, I think you gave a pretty balanced review over all but there were places where the Kip Adotta just came out and it have me cracking up at work. 

    Great show guys, keep up the cool work.

    Peace

    Dafixer

    (aka Umar)

  44. lantern4life lantern4life says:

    Saw it loved it.  Guillermo Del Toro makes Peter Jackson look like a bitch.  I’m so happy he’s making the Hobbit movies.  Now if on we can get him to make an original fantasy movie that doesn’t have a spanish war in it.

  45. Josh Flanagan josh (@jaflanagan) says:

    @DafixersHideout I see what you’re saying, but I was the only one who didn’t really like it.  And I really didn’t dislike it.  When I thought a movie was bad (a la Wanted), I said "that movie was bad."  This movie wasn’t bad.  It was just that I wanted one kind of meal, and got another when I got to the dinner table.  I might have been good chicken, but I wanted pork.

    Ya follow me?

    Also, don’t be talkin’ ’bout no Peter Jackson like that.  We’ll send Richard Taylor after you. 

  46. Eyun Eyun says:

    @lantern4life – Blasphemy, dude! Del Toro’s awesome, but let’s wait until he makes film without monsters before we start rating him a better film maker than Jackson (check out Heavenly Creatures). Peace, brother! :)

  47. ABCevie ABCevie says:

    Hey guys, just wanted to respond to the "Liz is having twins!!11!" thing. As Ron (I think) said, it would have been retarded and gimmicky in general–but has more weight and justification in this movie, in which a key plot point involved a set of twins who share a mental and physical link. Given the crap that this link caused throughout the story, Hellboy would have a lot more reason to be freaked out than just "oh no, two babies." It still wasn’t genius or anything, but not quite at "Cocktail" levels of lame.

  48. davelevine says:

    I went to see Hellboy 2 today. I loved it. Lots of fun. Granted I haven’t read the comics but I did enjoy this more than first live action movie or the two direct-to-video animated movies. I enjoyed the creatures even if some of them were reminiscent of the ones from Pan’s Labyrinth or a Miyazki movie. Possibly they tried to pack a little too much into this movie but I had fun and did not feel at all like I had wasted my money or should have waited to see it on DVD.

    I listened to your podcast after seeing the movie and was suprised you guys didn’t enjoy it more than you did. I give it a glowing thumbs up and on the whole think it was better than Iron Man, but just barely. Iron Man was also great. One thing that Hellboy 2 has IMHO over Iron Man is a better final fight scene. Maybe I’m comparing apples and oranges though. They were both great movies but for different reasons. There was no Robert Downey, Jr. performance in Hellboy but Iron Man didn’t have the amount of eye candy that Hellboy did.

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